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01 August 2010

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Jeff Pellne

If I'm Jeff "PellStine," this statement is falsely portraying me:
•Stan has never offered to meet with me, so perhaps he's confusing me with somebody else. Commenters on my blog have invited Stan to participate, but he has declined. A meeting was proposed by some commenters — Anna Haynes, think — but it never materialized.
•I am not a "liberal" blogger. I am middle of the road, and have voted for Republicans and Democrats over the years. A family member is a registered GOP. My politics are more along the lines of my supervisor, Nate Beason. So I guess he's a "liberal" too.

Most important, this statement sidesteps the real issue that was raised in George's post by Tea Party leaders: Why isn't George or Stan addressing the criticism alleged by Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naratelli at George or the Mecklers? Why didn't George disclose his financial contribution to Mark Meckler until now? George's defense seems to be that the "Meckler's" told him so.

http://jeffpelline.wordpress.com/2010/08/01/local-blogger-rebane-caught-in-middle-of-meckler-dust-up/

Mandy Morello

Stan I guess I know which tree the bad apple fell out of… I covered the Feb 27th, 2009. I was the only media to come down to the capitol to see what this Lawyer and his family were doing because of Santelli's rant her in Sac. Had Mark Williams not jumped up on the planter box that day to make some noise or wrote about it on his blog back then, Sac Tea Party would have been nothing more than "just your family down there alone."

I am the one that designed the back of the very first Tax Day Tea Party shirt, it was my contacts that got the deal for the printing of the shirts and the printing of the fliers shall I go on?!!!!Just a photographer huh, That means I have photographic proof to back up my emails to and from Patty and Mark!

Mandy Morello

For the Record, I NEVER CALLED MYSELF A LEADER OF ANYTHING!!!!

Mandy Morello

George- why did you turn off the comments to the previous article? I tried to reply but the comment section would not take it. That is ok, posted my complete reply to Jeff's article about yours.

George Rebane

Mandy - I have not turned off any comments to any of my posts. But TypePad has its own little quirks, please try again.

Mandy Morello

Here is the photo album from the very first Tea Party that Stan so easily forgot:http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x192/amorello5401/Tea%20Party%20Feb%2027%202009/

Here is my article about that day published in a paper of general distribution: http://americanrivermessenger.com/pdf_files/vol_4_pdfs/MessengerVol4Iss5.pdf

I got front page and top fold for that article....I know someone will say your article says television, radio and news media covered the event... I was news media and Mark Williams fell under the category of TV and Radio. As you can see from the pictures there were no news crews nor were there any cameras other than mine and maybe another video camera.

George Rebane

For the record - I cannot address any of these issues about TPP affairs that are outside Nevada County because I have no direct knowledge of any of the goings on. JeffP would do well to keep this record straight on his blog.

And JeffP, I have no obligation to disclose to you or anybody else the private contributions my family makes to anyone. If the receiver has such obligations, then look to them. Your understanding of US Code and the ethics of giving needs a major tune-up.

Laura Boatright

Stan-

With all due respect, what you have is 2000 CONTACTS, and same goes with Tea Party Patriots. There is a difference. That matters to ME as a local organizer because THEY solicit funds from MY BACKYARD and (just like TPP said about TPE) DO NOT FUNNEL *ANY* OF THAT FUNDING TO THE LOCAL GROUPS...NONE. That is something that our "members" don't know. So, TPP has yardsigns and tee shirts that don't have any place for the local groups web address...just TPP. Why? CONTACTS TO SOLICIT. (I know it, Mark knows it, and you know it. And I know that you both know it.) IT HAS BECOME ALL ABOUT POWER, CONTROL, AND MONEY.

Not to minimize the MOVEMENT, but Tea Party Patriots as an org hasn't accomplished CRAP...the local groups have, DESPITE the ongoings and distractions, personal vendettas and POSITIONING/BRANDING, and meetings with the GOP/RNC that Mark has attended to.

So, speak to the ISSUES, Stan. Big deal that you/they have contact lists...who cares?
Speak about Mark's relationship with McClintock. His poor judgment in the Gov campaign. His seemingly favorable attitude with Poizner, an establishment HACK, fulltime POLITICIAN.

FTR- why is it important for Mark to claim "national founder"?? POSITIONING.
I claim that title too, along with ALL THE OTHERS who built this movement. Mark, Jenny Beth, Amy Kremer, Michael Patrick Leahy, Eric Odom, and Stacy Mott, sure as hell DID NOT BUILD THIS ALONE. In fact, I came to the movement via Freedom Works. Prior to that, I was ALREADY printing my own little "articles" about the Constitution and EC101 bullet points in front of my local WalMart. Prior to THAT I had been doing voter registration, GOTV, working booths and tables several times a week, etc...

Mark HIMSELF has caused much of this fracture. Mark is about MARK. It's become evident and more evident every day that passes. And I don't even have to tell anyone, they are coming to the conclusions themselves.

First it was branding the name "Tea Party Patriots", now it's about the trademark, and suing/controlling groups/individuals who used the name that Mark encouraged, under FALSE PRETENSES, IMO.

So, say what you want Stan. I am not about the iconography, or personalities...I could care less about that. What I care about is CONDUCT: INTEGRITY, PRINCIPLES.

I fervently defended Mark and Patty when they were being wronged. Not because they were "my friends", but because they were being WRONGLY ACCUSED.

Same with Mr. Larry Naritelli. Same with MANY Tea Party organizers across CA and USA. And NOW with Mandy Morello.

Mark should have known that I would counter any MISREPRESENTATIONS that he makes public, just as passionately as I did when it was being leveled against him. I know Alinsky tactics when I see them, better yet, I know how to wield them too.

"Freeze, personalize, polarize." Yeah, we get it. And we won't stand for it in our own camp for the gain of ANY ONE PERSON OR GROUP. for all the talk about "solidarity" and "team spirit" TPP/Mark Meckler sure aren't LEADING BY EXAMPLE. By HIS actions he has done more damage to the solidarity than I thought anyone could. Good going, Mark.

This is an organic movement, it is not "owned" by anyone. Not Mark. Not Tea Party Patriots. Or Freedom Works, American Solutions, or any other national group.

~Laura Boatright
http://teapartyie.com
NATIONAL CO-FOUNDER OF TEA PARTY MOVEMENT- ALONG WITH 10,000 OTHERS.

Steve Enos

What is Mark Meckler all about?... Mark Meckler.

Consider the following:

1. When the Mark Williams "dust up” started Mark Meckler ran to the press and tossed Williams under the bus as fast as he could.

Mark Meckler went to the press and made statements and claims that he, Mark Meckler THE Tea Party Leader had been warning the Tea Party about Mark Williams from the start.

But in these press interviews bashing Mark Williams Mark Meckler forgot to mention he had long running connections and a history with Mark Williams. Mark Meckler forgot to disclose that he and Williams appeared and spoke together in the past. He forgot to mention that in 2009 the Meckler's selected Mark Williams to be The MC/Host/speaker at the TPP gathering here in Nevada County. He forgot to mention a bit of a falling out after that. Seems Mark Meckler forgets a lot of things.

Seems Mark Meckler forgot his relationship and past appearances with Mark Williams and instead ran to the press to claim he warned everyone about Mark Williams long ago. Sorry, this is the behavior of an opportunist.

2. What about the private use of the Tea Party membership email database by Mark Meckler to send out a plea for Tea Party members to “donate” money for his PERSONAL use?

Mark Meckler used and emailed the Tea Party membership list asking folks to send checks to his personal address and indicate they were for his "PERSONAL" use.

Combine this misuse of the membership list with the comments being raised by others here. Folks with the ture story and direct knowledge in the Tea Party are now providing information about Mark Meckler and money and they raise questions about Mark Mecklers use of the national Tea Party sites donations.

Pam Silleman posts Mark Meckler and hsi quest for money and control… “He receives all of the donations made to our national site, but when one of his groups needs advice (he is an attorney after all).… he DEMANDS MONEY.”

Wouldn’t an attorney know that it’s not a good idea to use the Tea Party membership email database to send out pleas for Tea Party members to “donate” money for his PERSONAL use?

This issue about the misuse of the Tea Party membership email database and the donations to the Tea Party and Mark Mecklers “personal” account funds should be looked into.

What about Mark Meckler getting paid a lot of money from the Lincoln Club of Orange County PAC?

From what folks are now saying and disclosing and the information that is starting to flood out it’s clear all this should be looked into.

The issue is… will it?

Jeff Pellne

George,
On the issue I raised, you absolutely have an obligation to disclose your financial contribution to Mark Meckler to your readers, because you write about him regularly. You also write a column for The Union and should be held to some ethical standards. A little structure is important, just as when it comes to starting non-profits.

Steve Enos

Here's another false claim by Stan Meckler and I have the emails to prove Stan Meckler is not telling the truth it:

Stan Meckler claims above that... "Jeff Pelline and Steve Enos are just two of the many that I have tried to meet. Why won't they meet? What are they afraid of? Are they scared of the truth?"

Well Stan Meckler isn’t telling the truth folks. I had a few email exchanges with Stan Meckler in the past. And I sent an email to Stan asking him to explain his side of the story about his violations of private property rights and free speech during a past election in Nevada County.

As soon as I raised this issue and asked Stan Meckler if he would provide his side of the story, Stan Meckler stopped all communication with me. I send a number of emails asking Stan Meckler to reply, I asked him to give his side of the story, I asked him for the truth.

Stan Meckler refused to respond once I raised the issue about his trespassing and free speech violations.

So what happened? What did Stan Meckler do? Why did Stan Meckler refuse to respond with his side of the story to confirm or deny it?

In a past election here in Nevada County Stan Meckler was caught red handed trespassing onto another’s property where he tore down a political campaign sign of a Nevada County Board of Supervisors candidate, a candidate that Stan Meckler didn't like.

After getting caught Stan Meckler had a conversation with the candidate and asked that he not be reported.

I had been emailing with Stan Meckler and as soon as I raised the issues of him violating someone else’s property rights and free speech Stan Meckler refused to communicate.

Private property rights and free speech are provided for and protected by our very own Constitution. In fact they are corner stones of our Constitution.

Seems Stan Meckler and Mark Meckler have a lot in common.

Thank you to those helping to get the word out about what has been going. I have raised many of these issues in the past only to have George Rebane, Russ Steele, Todd Juvinall and Barry Pruett attack me for doing so. Seems these same folks can’t handle the truth you bring forward. Thanks to all for pulling back the rug and exposing the truth about Stan and Mark Meckler and what they have been up to.

Mark Meckler doe not own the Tea Party, he does not own Tea Party Patriots regardless of how had he tries to make it so and profit from it while attacking others that do it for free, that do out of true conviction for the cause.

Laura Boatright

I'm in So Cal, so I don't really keep abreast of the shenanigans in the Mecklers' home turf...however, the damage TPP has done to the movement in Cali IS INEXCUSABLE and DISGUSTING.

What they "appear to be" and what they ARE are two different things.

I don't like publicly denouncing them...wish they'd just keep their mouths shut. But since they don't, I am forced to respond PUBLICLY as well.

They ALL know me, and my integrity is UNQUESTIONABLE. I have been consistent from the beginning. There's so much more to this story...and if they continue to wage this public war...so be it, it will ALL come out.

My advice, Mr. Meckler(s) and TPP...SHUT UP. And get to work for the sake of our state and nation.

Russ Steele

This personal snipping is just a distraction from the real issue.There are 50 millions dissatisfied voters that are joining local Tea Parties, Freedomworks, and the 9.12 Project. They all came together a million strong in Washington DC, in one of the most beautiful gatherings ever held on the Capitol Mall. What happens if they come together as a single voting block in November? That potential scares the s**t out of the liberal/progressives.

Yes, every grassroots movement has had organizational problem, even among our founding fathers. The original 13 states and their leaders did not like each other much, each being a strong leader in their own states. Yet, they saw the need and put aside petty differences and came together to create an strong nation.

There always strong individuals vying for a leadership role, creating friction and some name calling. The left will take every opportunity to exploit these small fractures with in the ranks of these grass roots organizations. We are seeing that strategy played our right here in Nevada County, as the liberal/progressive an their fellow travelers try to foment discord among California Tea Party leaders.

We need to look at the larger picture, there is a powerful grass roots movement that is a huge danger to the progressive/liberal Democrat who currently in power. They will continue to seek ways to attack these grassroots organizations, the most visible being the rapidly growing Tea Parties Patriots.

My advice is to ignore the snippers like Enos and Pelline, keeping the larger issues in sight. I was watching the Glenn Beck Friday program on the DVR with the Tea Party leaders, Freedomworks and the 9.12 project. I think this meeting and discussion could be the basis of a real healing moment. Especially, if they all went out for dinner and a drink after the show. I heard a lot of agreement around the table on Friday night.

Legitimate attacks should be answered and then move on. Mark Williams racism was dealt with, now it is time to move on. It is a huge waste of time deal with the snippers who are only seeking to create more problems for the Tea Party organizer. Problems that diverts leaders from focusing on the real goals in November. Electing leaders that believe in smaller government, following the constitution and fiscal responsibility.

Laura Boatright

Exactly, Russ...tell TPP via Mark Meckler to knock it off.

Jeff Pellne

Russ,
Don't shoot the messenger: Read what these people are saying, including Laura Boatright's comment right above yours. That's the real issue.

Larry Naritelli

With all due respect to Stan, I really do not understand the purpose of the false allegations made against me during the primary by his son Mark. Also the blog by the TPP progressive in Maine and the other false claims to create damage to my name and get endorsements pulled from me based on total falsehoods by his staff. His associates made wild and baseless claims to try to damage my family. Then they kept going with emails after the primary to keep trying to discredit me. All I did was volunteer for his organization all last year. What purpose did it serve Mark to conduct a smear campaing of falsehoods. Show me the evidence of any one of his allegations. There is none and Mark's organization should be ashamed of themselves for sinking into the gutter the way they did.
Where are the FBI investigations Mark? Prove Dawn Wildman's claims. Explain Andrew Ian Dodge's lies. Guilty until proven innocent is how your organization acts. That is too progressive for America. I'm sorry Stan, but I would scold my son if he engaged in the same type of acts Mark, Dawn, and Andrew engaged in. And Jenny Beth Martin needs to explain why she condones it. Every single allegation they made against me is completely untrue. Every single one.

Steve Enos

Thank you to Laura, Mandy and the others that are bringing forward the facts and the real information about the scam being conducted by the Meckler's.

See how Russ Steele avoids addressing the facts and issues you raise? See how he instead attacks me and you and others for bringing forth the truth?

See that Russ Steele, George Rebane and the Meckler's fail to respond to the issues raised? No surprise to those raising the issues!

It's very clear who the true Patriots are vs. those claimimg to be THE Tea Party leaders, the same folks that are missusing the Tea Party membership information to seek donations for their "Personal" use.

As Laura Boatright bravely stated about the Meckler's... "What they "appear to be" and what they ARE are two different things".

Instead of addressing the issues they attack Laura and Mandy and those others that are now standing up to the Meckler's.

Laura said "There's so much more to this story...and if they continue to wage this public war...so be it, it will ALL come out".

Time for it all to come out, time for the truth to come out.

VforVendetta

I for one AM in Mark's backyard and have been in the movement from the beginning as well. I'd love the opportunity to meet with Stan OR Mark ANYTIME, ANYWHERE......my ONLY pre-condition, is that the media be there to here the facts from those that been in this form the beginning.....and KNOW where the bodies are buried. I have no time for a "yes he did, no he didn't, yes he did, no he didn't" with Stan Meckler. I have the facts and screenprints, emails, etc. to back me up, and will provide them (along with how they ALL tie together) to anyone that truly wants to get the truth out. Steve, my writing skills are least to be desired, my verbal skills are far better, I've been considering a vlog to get the truth out, but think you might be interested in hearing what I've got to say. Shoot me an email at politicalwatchdog69@yahoo.com, I'll send you my phone # and we can talk, hope to hear from you soon. V

Laura Boatright

PS- Mark's M.O. is to enlist the help of associated BLOGGERS.
Larry is correct, Mark/TPP enlisted Andrew Ian Dodge to smear him...I countered that garbage too.

Mr. Rebane- the movement is about ACCOUNTABILITY AND TRANSPARENCY. So, I think for the sake of FULL DISCLOSURE AND DISCLAIMER you SHOULD tell us what you have given to Meckler, Sac Tea Party, Nevada County Tea Party Patriots, etc...let's just get it ALL out in the open.

And Larry, what you said above is 100% correct, which is why I fought FOR YOU against Meckler/Wildman/CATPP on principle. Now, please, practice what YOU preach. (You know what I am talking about.)

Laura Boatright

@Steve-

To my knowledge, Mark Meckler/TPP has not attacked me. They can't. They have nothing on me because I am always HONEST AND VERY, VERY FORTHRIGHT (in case you couldn't tell).

I also have nothing for them to take from me...the only darned thing I own is (a currently broken down) 1984 MB 190D.

I don't solicit funds from my contacts. I/Tea Party IE is NOT a registered NFP. Why? I stand on the Constitution, and IMO, NFPs are illegal limits of our free speech, free association, etc...(ya know, "tea party issues") I also don't pull permits for my events...same reason. If we are going to fight for the Constitution, LET'S DO IT!

I don't stand by GOProgressives (Whitman, Poizner, and Fiorina...Graham, McCain, and even Sarah Palin the turncoat who supports GOPregressives)or Marxist-Democrats (nearly ALL Dems)...but I am also not interested in becoming a Libertarian...why? I am post-partisan. The parties have outlived their usefulness...we don't NEED them, they are self-serving, not in our INTERESTS. They tell us NOTHING of any candidate running (cf: Meg Whitman, GOProgressive). I maintain that the only reason the LP is "clean" is because they have not attained any power. As soon as they do, they will have the same problems as the "big two"...why? HUMAN NATURE DOES NOT CHANGE. But I do tell everyone the TRUTH, which is that I am a registered Republican. Now, Mark Meckler is a DTS but cuddles up with the GOP machine...but not publicly, THAT would break FEC/IRS rules pertaining to NFP (501s). So much more important to follow the law than to be HONEST AND TRANSPARENT.

Todd Juvinall

Russ, your recommendations are the most cogent. A group od people always has internal strife of some sort, even a family. The trick in political movement is don't let the personal issues wreck the movement. I have yet to see any positive story's on the leftwing blog about the TPP or its founders. I have yet to see anything posititive from Enos. Of course, Enos's style is pretty much always tearing down others and their ideas, nothing new there. My suggestion is let the detractors deal with each other, and continue to portray the overall goals of the TPP in the manner of their positive attributes.

RL Crabb

I think the blogger is calling the kettle black and blue, Todd. I remember all your positive suggestions over on Pelline's blog...not.

Face it, when the tea party starts airing its grievances of Jeff's blog, there's trouble in paradise.

Todd Juvinall

RL, you need to stop whining fella. I post positive stuff all the time. When I confront detractors like you and Pelline, I defend myself. So, man up.

Mikey McD

It is so very American to have the petty drama take center stage and the worthy values of the movement ignored. Pride and Egos need to be set aside for the sake of un-enslaving our kids. Folks, let's focus on fiscal responsibility, constitution, and free markets.

For the record, I have not heard Mark or any other tea party 'member' bad mouth anyone except politicians and racists.

Steve Enos

Hey Todd Juvinall, Russ Steele and George Rebane...

Just keep on avoiding and ducking and spinning all you want. Keep attacking Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and the others that are raising real issues about Mark and Stan Meckler and what they have been up to. It doesn't matter becasue the truth is now getting out and it's very clean you made a big mistake drinking the Meckler Coolaide.

You have a chance to wake from your Meckler dream world and listen to the truth, but alas you can't seem to do that. Instead you make attacks against those with the conviction to stand up and tell the truth.

These are folks that worked in, with and for the Tea Party movement from the start, involved people, committed people, dedicated people, peole that know the truth, people that have raised real issues that you brush off.

Continue to claim this is about Steve Enos or Jeff Pelline, continue to avoid the reality that has come knocking on your door. Continue to discredit those raising these important issues.

Instead how about getting Mark and Stan Meckler to respond to what has come to light? What's wrong, can't the Meckler's respond here, on Rebane's conservative blog site, the site claimed to be about facts and truth and discusion?

George... since you have direct contact with the Meckler's and you posted Stan's initial "response" you are the perfect person to requst Stan and Mark to respond here, for all to see. Or will they hide and fail to enguage in the discussion that is taking place... what do they have to hide?

It's simple, if Stan and Mark Meckler avoid responding here, if they avoid addressing the issues here they only confirm that what Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and others are saying here.

George, instead of another story about PG&E Smart meters, how about dealing with this, something of real importance... if you dare!

Mikey McD

debates are NOT won based on the quantity of words, but the quality. It is important to focus on solutions to our debt and ever shrinking liberty instead of lame 4th grade drama.

Steve Enos

So Mikey McD... Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern are 4th graders? Do you have any idea who these fine folks are? Do you have any idea the work and effort these folks have undertaken?

These folks are raising real issues about Mark and Stan Meckler and what they have been up to. These folks have been in the effort from the very statrt and they know what has been going on. Discount them all you want, but they know and they have the proof!

Can you address their issues and not insult and attack these folks?

You say... "focus on solutions to our debt and ever shrinking liberty"... wake up Mikey McD because that is what Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern have been doing from the start!

For you to call them a bunch of 4th graders is beyond the pale and a 100% insult to those working for the cause!

Mikey McD

Enos, your ability to thrive in the hateful schoolyard bully attack mode is exactly why I fear big government. Planners (read slave drivers) like you are the enemy. Your obsessive disdain for personal liberty is treasonous.
This petty TP drama does not concern me (or you)- it is nothing more than a bunch of egos run amok. FOCUS: WE need solutions (*which I've offered consistently), not drama.

Unfortunately the clock does not stop ticking due to petty drama: http://www.usdebtclock.org/

Mikey McD

I DON'T/WON'T FOLLOW PEOPLE... I will follow the values of fiscal responsibility, adherence to the constitution and free market capitalism.
Now you want to make a mountain our of a mole hill...
ENOS = HYPOCRITE!
It is hypocritical for the Enos' of the world to all of the sudden think the volunteers of the freedom movement respectable when just days ago the hypocrites labels said volunteers as "fringe - racist -right wing extremists."

Dixon Cruickshank

"As Laura Boatright bravely stated about the Meckler's... "What they "appear to be" and what they ARE are two different things"."


Whew, Sure glad we don't have that issue with you

RL Crabb

Who's whining, Todd? I'm just making an observation here. You know as well as I do, if this were the Rural Quality Coalition you'd be be all over yourself gloating. At least I'm bipartisan when I dole out the criticism.

Steve Enos

Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern are raising real, important issues about the Meckler's and how the Meckler's have been using the Tea Party for profit and to gain power while attacking others that have been working for the cause. Can't you grasp that?

The response from Mikey McD and Dixon... they don't address the issues, they make personal attacks and let the personal insults fly.

How can you discount, ignore and attack Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern instead of addressing the issues they raise? How about you start by addressing these two issues:

How do you feel about the misuse of the Tea Party membership email database by Mark Meckler to seek donations from the Tea Party members for his “personal” use vs. the Tea Party. Seems that some laws, much less the trust of the Tea Party members might have been violated by this. Can you address this?

And what about Mark Meckler getting paid a lot of money from the Lincoln Club of Orange County PAC?

It was Laura Boatright that posted about the Meckler's that... "What they "appear to be" and what they ARE are two different things".

Try to discount, ignore and disparage Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern and the others that are bringing forward the real information about the Meckler's... the truth is now getting out and seems you and a few others can't deal with the truth and can't address these issues.

It's real clear whom the real hypocrites are.

Todd Juvinall

RL, you write an excellent comic strip. You skewer mostly the right. The strip is a negative strip most of the time. I hardly think you should be whining about anyone else posting negative.

George Rebane

The conversation here seems to be leading to no new revelations, at least no productive ones that would help the TPP address its shortcomings, and go forward better able to promote its core principles in the country’s political arena. We seem to be trading allegations with at least half the traders interested in seeing the TP movement fold its tent and disappear into the ‘dustbin of history’.

Today I noticed that Jeff Pelline’s blog is republishing huge parts of RR with interstitial commentary, and a budding comment thread of its own that appears equally sterile. (I may have to start reading Jeff’s contributions now that the direction of content flow has been settled.) Unfortunately I have no more to contribute than what is already in these pages. And I have no special ability to encourage either of the Mecklers to respond any more than they care to on RR.

But these comment threads have been valuable for me in highlighting the expected dissensions in the formative process of a loosely led and widely dispersed organization whose core principles I support and of which I am a member. My little brainbone is humming with attempts to answer questions such as ‘what is a sustainable structure for an organization fostering political and social ideals that seeks to grow while remaining independent of the established ‘business-as-usual’ political parties and candidates seeking election?’

When I have something to add that points toward answers – mine or mined, fully baked or not – I will post them, and then look forward to the usual discussion/critiques which these pages foster. Until then, perhaps Jeff’s blog would be a more suitable venue on which to continue the current ‘progress’.

RL Crabb

Editorial cartooning is a negative business. It's called satire. The Mecklers are among the hierarchy of the national Tea Party movement,(if such a thing exists in this supposedly leaderless group) so it's only natural that I would comment on something that's started in my own backyard and stretches all the way to Glenn Beck's studio. And yes, it's even more rife for satire when Steve Enos embraces the movement.

I can't make up stuff this good.

Todd Juvinall

George, good comments.

RL, thanks for confirming.

Steve Enos

Wow! George ducks the issues raised and sends Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern to Jeff Peline's blog to continue the discussion about the Tea Party issues they raise?

Now I have seen everything!

George says... "The conversation here seems to be leading to no new revelations, at least no productive ones that would help the TPP address its shortcomings".

What IS missing is a real response from Mark and Stan Meckler to the important issues being raised here.

What the heck… the Meckler’s claim to be THE Tea Party leaders but refuse to be accountable to the Tea Party members raising these issues?

So much for transparency and accountability. Talk about hypocrites!

Not to worry, this is all set to hit the national media. Seems George's blog site and all this will get some national attention soon.

The cat is out of the bag and the light has been turned on by folks like Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern... thank you for telling the truth!

Laura Boatright

Let's just get one thing straight here, it's MECKLER who chooses to air "dirty laundry" publicly. The rest of us are simply ANSWERING the topic at hand.

As I said in my initial post (on the original article), HE has chosen to keep the Williams' story ALIVE, which taints the movement TOO, INSTEAD of placing the "racist issue" SQUARELY WHERE IT BELONGS: ON THE LEFT. "They" *OWN* the history and people like Meckler choose to settle personal vendettas rather than "never let a good crisis go to waste" and educate the public...MAKE THEM RESEARCH THE FACTS AND THINK!

TPP/Meckler made a formal statement about Williams' blog...IT SHOULD HAVE ENDED THERE.

Is it that he, like so many "conservatives" and America at large, don't KNOW the history? Or is he afraid to broach the subject? Or is he more concerned with positioning TPP over TPE? Or does he have an unhealthy need to "settle the score" with Mark Williams as a personal matter?

These aren't just "growing pains"...those of you on the outside don't know the division that Meckler has CAUSED here in Cali. You don't know the underhanded tactics, or threats, or that ORGANIZERS (team players, the ones who spend their TIME working tables and walking neighborhoods...LIKE THE "LEADERS" DON'T DO) are having to spend their hard-earned money to PROTECT THEIR PROPERTY FROM TEA PARTY PATRIOTS by incorporating. THAT doesn't bother anyone?? It sure ticks ME off!

I'm sick of it also. I'd prefer to concentrate on exposing the REAL "Cracker Party" (Democrat->Confederate->Democrat->Jim Crow/Poll Tax/KKK->segregationist->dogs & firehoses on Freedom Fighters->now Marxist; Equal Opportunity Oppressors Party) that intends to put us all back on the farm and institute Plantation Economics...but NOOOOO! We have to sit here and talk about which group has the most contacts, how great the Mecklers are, defend organizers who have given their ALL (and continue to,despite the "friendly fire") and discuss who are the rightful "owners" of the title "FOUNDER(S)" of the movement.

PS- I don't see any criticism here about Meckler communicating with TPMuckraker (liberal blogger) when it serves his purposes...how about applying the same rules to all? That's kind one of the things that the TP movement is about too. "Equal JUSTICE", right?

Steve Enos

Russ Steele, the Meckler defender has just posted the following under George's "Smart meter story".

Russ Steele goes after Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern and says they have "bruised egos" and no proof that the Meckler's have been up to no good.

Russ, be careful what you ask for!

Here's part of Russ's slam on Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern:

"One other thought, with out specific evidence to support the claims of Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern could it be we are just dealing with some bruised egos. They all claimed to have e-mails, screen shots and photos evidence of wrong doing, but we have not seen this evidence posted to web sites were the data can be observed and evaluated by third parties. Why? You are accepting their side of the story with our doing any critical thinking. Why?

Todd Juvinall

Steve Enos, you need to get a scanner and a life. We don't care that you hate the TPP. This is a conservative blog so you are spitting into the wind. Stay over a the leftwing blog where dissent from liberal ideology is censored by the dictator.

RL Crabb

Todd, you do me wrong. Nowhere here have I made a negative judgement on the allegations against the Mecklers. I only illustrate the negativity that comes from those on the opposing sides. For the past twelve years I've called on both camps to hold a reasonable dialogue. It's only in that endeavor that I consider my efforts to be an utter failure. Unlike you, I'll continue trying.

(Forgive me, George. This will be my last comment on my supposed bias.)

Steve Enos

Earth to Todd Juvinall... Mandy Morello and Dave Kern have been posting on Jeff Peline's blog site about these issues. That's because you and a few others here and the Meckler's refuse to respond to the issues they have raised.

Attack the messengers all you want, but the messages are getting out for folks to see.

Mandy Morello

OMGosh this is truly a disgusting and pathetic reader base you have here George. The obvious idolatry your readers have towards a man rather than the movement is just sickening.

I would like to ask whom here has heard of myself, Laura, David or Larry before these posts? Nobody except Steve, which by the way has never said anything against TPP the organization or the the actual members of TPP...he has only questioned the leadership! Since nobody has heard of us, how could we be inflating our own egos? The only ego being inflated as they see their minions band together blindly attacking whomever they please , spinning the questioning away from himself as masterfully as Obama crafted to his blind mindless followers, is Meckler .

George, I have been told that you have erased a comment made by David Jenest from Crimewatch, informing you that your posts come very close to slander and liable. Now unlike Meckler, I do not sue a fellow Patriot for whom they befriend and like Laura stated above we did not comment here for any other reason than to tell the truth from the lies you are posting that pertain to us. The reason we have not made a website to air the dirty laundry is because we are above that and if we put energy into taking down an annoyance rather than to stop our elected leaders from destroying our country, what would that prove? Plus in order to fully out Meckler, there will be many that do not need to involved in this but will be dragged into this playground fight, Meckler knows who they are, we know who they are and so do the other leaders.

The rest of us have bigger fights than playing ring-around-the-rosie with a backwoods blogger that has most likely never been to anything other than the Monster rallies at the capitol (which I helped put on) or wrote anything other than what Meckler tells him to.

We have real work to do in order to help save this nation. There are still about 30% nationwide that are still under Obama's spell ....looks like the same rings true for the morons following Meckler.

George Rebane

Mandy, thanks for clearing up 'David Jenest from Crimewatch'. It looked like a spam post when I went to the linked site so I erased it. If my "posts come very close to slander and liable(sic)", then he needs to include the specifics so that we can all assess his serious accusation. Please inform him of this. (Here are some interesting pieces on this David Jenest http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/09/297524.shtml)

Now about you Mandy, you know very little about me and have added precious little to this conversation since your first comment. Your continued unscaffolded vitriol is beginning to be tiresome to this "backwoods blogger", and therefore I strongly recommend that you either bring something more to this party, or quit playing "ring-around-the-rosie" on RR.

Steve Enos

"George, I have been told that you have erased a comment made by David Jenest from Crimewatch, informing you that your posts come very close to slander and liable".

George is this true? Did you do this?

Mandy Morello

Seeing that I have already posted this email on my facebook post that Steve has posted here, I will give you just the tip of the iceberg of "something more I can bring to this party" This will also point out that, like I said above, the outing of Meckler would bring unnecessary turmoil to other leaders that do not need Meckler's wrath and lies spread about them.

You asked for it, now you deal with it.... looks like one of your own has a problem with Mark, his DEMANDS on the Tea Party Leaders and his childish behavior. Careful what you wished for George, you just might get it.

And as for David's comments, how could they be spam when they site a specific name or topic described in this thread?

-----Original Message-----
From: Ginny Rapini
To: amorello5401 ; EMAILS HAVE BEEN REMOVED TO PROTECT THE BOARD MEMBERS
Sent: Tue, May 25, 2010 4:59 pm
Subject: Board Decision on Debate

OK - after talking to each one of you today, the majority rule is that we proceed with supporting the debate. Mandy, Steve and Del said to move forward. Walt said no and Hank was a bit hesitant. I did not vote because I am in the middle of this unnecessary drama and have VERY STRONG FEELINGS ABOUT IT RIGHT NOW!

This issue with Mark and Larry is way overblown and shouldn't cause a boycott of a debate among candidates that none of us are endorsing or promoting in any way. So what. Mark and Larry have an issue. Is that justification to pull away from an educational forum that our people have been begging for? I think not. (I can say that now that the vote is in). What do the rest of the candidates have to do with Larry and Mark's disagreement? NOTHING.

I did what Mark requested I do. Namely, I removed the TPP logo from sponsorship on all the fliers and e-mails that are going out. I also sent out a Constant Contact e-mail to his Sacramento list and told them the we were retracting our sponsorship. That was worse to do than if we'd just quietly back away. But NO - that's what Mark demanded! It's his site, so I did it. I did not, however, send out a retraction from our site and have no intention of doing so.

This whole thing has taken up and wasted and entire day of my time and I'm taking heat like you wouldn't believe from those on his list wondering what I am doing to destroy Mark! Or what I'm doing to poor Larry. Why did I cancel the debate? How could I bring this down singlehandedly? This is a nightmare and an unnecessary one at that.

So - our meeting is cancelled. Steve, can you call Patrick and tell him? I will send out more e-mails from our site (removing Mecklers however - all of them) reminding them of the debate.

Well, just while I've been writing this cute little note, my e-mail box is filling faster than I can count so off I go to hear more CRAP from those "concerned" TPers! It's easy to understand the fight we have with the enemy. It's tough to realize that we also have to fight those from within!

Ginny Rapini
NorCal Tea Party Patriots Coordinator
California State Advisor
Sacramento Coordinator
norcalteaparty1@aol.com
P.O. Box 236
Colfax, CA 95713
(530) 389-2464
www.NorCalTeaPartyPatriots.org


Sarah H

Mandy Morello = Benedict Arnold?

Mandy Morello

Do you even know the definition of Bendict Arnold? Apparently not! Benedict Arnold fought against the Patriots for England to prevent America from Independence.... Name one thing that Mark Meckler has done in order to get some real action done? Has he collected signatures for any of the initiatives, has he been the man on the street? No he hasn't, he has been a media whore himself.

Name any idea he has solely come up with that has been successful...nothing.. where is Citizen Power Campaign on the ballot. Instead he spends the hard earned, donated dollars to fly around the country bashing other TP Organizations or threatening leaders, that actually get the work done, with lawsuits or booting them from the TPP. That is the true definition of a Bendict Arnold...someone that is preventing the masses from escaping tyranny for his own personal gain!

George Rebane

Dear People - some of the TPP debate and comments leaked into the next post which has nothing to do with the subject matter at hand here. I have implemented a new comment policy described here -
http://rebaneruminations.typepad.com/rebanes_ruminations/2010/08/new-comment-policy-on-ruminations.html

Steve Enos

Since Sarah H. calls Mandy Morello... a “Benedict Arnold” maybe Sarah H. will stand up and provide her full name for folks to see.

I give much credit and respect to Mandy for stepping up for what she believes in, it's brave and needed. In addition a big thanks to Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern for standing up for what is right. Sorry to see the personal attacks being leveled at you folks, it’s just plain wrong on so many levels.

It is sad to see the threats that are now being directed at these folks for shinning light on what the Meckler's have been up to and how they have conducted themselves.

Wouldn't it be nice if Mark Meckler came forward to discuss these issues here? Will Mark Meckler join the conversation or will he continue to hide? Will this “Tea Party Profiteer” step up or will he sit back and allow others to attack and disparage Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli and Dave Kern in their efforts to protect the Meckler’s?

This is a classic case of The Emperor Has No Clothes. Are those that try to profit in a time of war Patriots or Profiteers? In this case it’s clear. Thank God there are folks willing to say what needs to be said, those willing to place the needs and interests of the many above the needs (and profits) of the few… that is being a true Patriot!

Sarah H. can call Mandy Morello a “Benedict Arnold” 24/7 but that won’t make it so. Those that standup to tyranny and oppression wherever it lives are true Patriots!

Todd Juvinall

No one cares about your opinion so go sit on your scanner.

pam silleman

Just to sum it up.......Mark Meckler IS a problem...........
Most all of us get along fine, better than fine actually. So, it is good that a Mark Meckler came around....NOW we know what we don't want: we dont' want a leader like Mark Meckler.........we DO NOT need a leader or spokesman!
Mark is an angry bossy power control freak.
He fooled me for a while.............but, after his rank and lies about Larry/Alex and how he totally screwed over Mandy, I cut myself off from him.
THEN< I realized that most all of the No Cal TPP groups had already pulled away from him for one reason or the other.
But, we all kept quiet for a long time..............NOT ANYMORE!
OPEN the books Mark..........show us your books! You have collected all of the national donations and all I have seen you spend the money on is to sue Amy and Jason!
Mark, you are NO team player. YOU are the problem, for goodness sake.PLEASE QUIT!! Your heart is not in the 'movement'. you think of just Mark and keeping the power and control of the money.
the Truth will set you FREE!....AND IF YOU WOULD QUIT, you would set us all free!

Russ Steele

Steve,

You are the great agent provoker, you do not give a damn about the success of the Tea Party. In the past you have disparaged the Tea Party idea and concept, now you all in favor of freeing them from the evil Meckler's. Why? What is your real purpose? Destruction of the Tea Party by inciting internal conflict?

What is next?

Jennifer Rockwell

Maybe it's time for a fresh perspective. At the request of Mandy, I have been following all of these blogs and comments for the last day and a half. She asked that I come on here and comment, but I felt that Pam, Laura, Larry and Mandy had things well under control. Unlike Pam, Laura, Mandy, & Larry, I have not been involved in the grassroots movement for the last year and a half, other than receiving emails from TPP, TPE, iCaucus, etc. I started to get more active in March 2010 when I learned of Larry Naritelli. Shortly after, I earned the position of his Northern California campaign manager and my eyes were opened to who Mark Meckler really is and what he is really about.

I have no dog in this fight. I've never been a "Tea Party Patriot". The only "Tea Party" functions I ever attended were on the campaign trail with the Naritelli campaign.

I don't think Meckler denies that he did in fact send out an email to TPP members all across California stating that the Naritelli campaign had threatened him and Dawn Wildman. He stated in that email that he contacted the FBI. If he did actually contact the FBI, they certainly never contacted the Naritelli campaign. And they didn't contact us, because NO THREATS WERE EVER MADE!

I don't need to rehash details. If you haven't read the details, you can here: http://republicdefender.ning.com/profiles/blogs/scandal-in-the-california

The fact of the matter is that Mark Meckler is a bully. If people don't do what he says, he throws a fit and threatens to sue...or actually does sue. He is divisive and causes strife. It appears that his goal is to make as much money as he can on this movement and then when he can't make any more money, he'll try to take it down. I have no problem with him making money. My question is: What is Meckler doing with all the money he collects? When people donate to TPP or pay the minimum $10 a month to be apart of the Tea Party Patriots 1st Brigade, what is that money going to support? Meckler has refused to support candidates or really get behind any ballot measures? So what is the money for?

My only goal here is to be one more voice WARNING people about Mark Meckler. I'm a relatively new voice and even I know that Meckler is bad news. Meckler only cares about Meckler. Period!

Jen Rockwell
http://newreaganpatriots.com
iCaucus District 3 Coordinator

Steve Enos

Perfect Russ... you and the other Meckler Protectors attack me and others vs. addressing the real issues raised by Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern and Pam Silleman.

Why don't you respond to the issues raised? Why don't you address the issues raised vs. trying to spin and deflection? What is YOUR real purpose Russ?

Why are you running cover for the Meckler's, can't they respond and speak for themselves?

I bet you are one of the Tea Party members that received the email from Mark Meckler seeking "donations" for his "PERSONAL" use.

Russ did you give money to Mark Meckler for his "personal use" just like we have now learned that George Rebane did? Care to disclose that?

Russ, how about addressing the import issues being raised here? How about you talk to your buddy Mark Meckler and have him stand up for himself?

How about asking Mark Meckler to, as Pam just asked... "OPEN the books Mark..........show us your books! You have collected all of the national donations and all I have seen you spend the money on is to sue Amy and Jason!"

Russ, attack me, attack Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern and Pam Silleman all you want, but it won't change a thing... people are standing up for what is right and it seems you are not one of those people.

Laura Boatright

@Russ- re:
Steve,

You are the great agent provoker, you do not give a damn about the success of the Tea Party. In the past you have disparaged the Tea Party idea and concept, now you all in favor of freeing them from the evil Meckler's. Why? What is your real purpose? Destruction of the Tea Party by inciting internal conflict?

What is next?
###

LMAO!!! Mark Meckler HIMSELF has CREATED this conflict. We are INSIDERS. We are PATRIOTS. Mark is a control-freak megalomaniac. Mark/TPP is BUILDING just another bureaucracy, isn't that what the Tea Party movement is SUPPOSED TO BE CONDEMNING, elitist, UNELECTED bureaucracies?

Starfish talk, and Spider walk.
~~~~~

Hey, Sarah, what IS your last name? (I think I know.) Mandy should be able to know who her accusers are. We've put our fannies on the line for principle, now why don't you do the same? Otherwise you get the "Meh" award.

Laura Boatright

PS- I have 39,000 emails in my inbox and all the replies to them (if I sent any)...not on purpose, I'm just kinda lazy that way.

Want the whole can opened? Keep it up, TPP/Mark, and any name-callers that might pop up.

Steve Enos

Now Russ Steele, George Rebane, Barry Pruett, Todd Juvinall, Sara H. and the other "Meckler Protectors" (MPs') will need to add Jen Rockwell to their growing hit list.

Time for the MP's to try and attack and discredit Jen too. Maybe they should start by calling Jen a “Benedict Arnold” just like they did to Mandy Morello.

When this many conservative folks, with inside and direct knowledge, folks that have a histroy with Mark Meckler raise the same issues and ask the simple question that Jen Rockwell just asked... "What is Meckler doing with all the money he collects?" it should sound an alarm bell!

So where's Mark Meckler? Is he firing up his word processor to starting new law suits against all the folks here that are raising these issues?

Russ Steele

Steve,

I have heard a lot of opinions and no evidence. Where are the facts? Can you point to some facts, all I am haring are opinions. I will be glad to address the facts. What I know is that the original concept for the Tea Party was a spider web of organizations, with no central structure. That did not work out, so the transitions was more more central management, which has created some conflicts. We are seeing evidence of those conflicts on this page. Mark is a co-leader. I do not hear any complaints about the other leaders listed on the web page.

The National Tea Party Patriots National Coordinator Team includes Debbie Dooley, Mike Gaske, Rob Gaudet, Jenny Beth Martin, Mark Meckler, Sally Oljar, Diana Reimer, and Dawn Wildman. All check in support of the organization go to Tea Party Patriots
1025 Rose Crk 620-322, Woodstock, GA 30189 Are all these people guilty of fraud as Mark's co-consperitors? Really? You evidence is?

Tea Party Patriots, Inc. operates as a social welfare organization organized under section 501(c)(4) of the Internal Revenue Code. They have specific reporting requirement, use the tool the IRS provides look the their books.

Who I donate money to is none of your business. If you thought my comments were an attack, you need to man up dude. This is not a second grade school yard, it is a discussion forum.

Steve Enos

"man up" you say Russ?...

Seems Laura, Pam, Jennifer and Mandy are the ones with the "stones" here, not the "Meckler Protectors".

This is why I think women should run things... these women have "stones"!

Laura Boatright

Russ-

The email that Mandy posted isn't enough proof of the control issues Meckler has? Or is Ginny one of "traitors" too?

What-E-ver, we all know the truth. I don't know who you are, but blind loyalty to people and groups (or parties), rather than critical thinking, is exactly why we are where we are today in America. I see ZERO difference with people on the "right" who stand with self-promoters they are emotionally attached to, and Obamabots. Be they Palinbots, Mecklerbots, GOPbots, CRPbots, etc.

Laura Boatright

Mickey McD, re: This petty TP drama does not concern me (or you)- it is nothing more than a bunch of egos run amok. FOCUS: WE need solutions (*which I've offered consistently), not drama.
###

Here's the deal: THE ONES IN THIS "SCHOOLYARD THREAD" HAVE PRODUCED REAL *RESULTS* in their areas of CA...Mark has trophies with his name AND TITLE on them from GOP/RINO head honchos, alienated and threatened organizers, Stan has 2000 contacts, TPP has access to Michael Steele and the newly formed "Tea Party Caucus" (sham, GOP usurpation) in congress ...oh, and really cool tee shirts and yardsigns. Let's not forget that.

You decide who is doing what to restore our Republic.

Steve Enos

There is one personal missing from this discussion... and that's Mark Meckler.

Will Mark Meckler address the folks and the issues they have raised here or... ?

Barry Pruett

Mark Meckler is not the Tea Party movement. The Tea Party ideology...fiscal responsibility by the government, adherance to the Constitution, and capitalism is more important than the whole bunch of commenters on these blogs...and my fellow patriots that are commenting here know that the movement is more important than any of us. Enos...nice try to cloud the issue in your effort to wreck the Tea Party. The movement will continue no matter how much you scream about Mark. That is the beauty of the Tea Party movement. There is no head to chop off...but you go ahead and keep trying to find one. If Mark, Laura, Mandy, or any of the leaders quit today...the Tea party would keep going like the Energizer bunny.

Steve Enos

You bet Barry Pruett. Just keep attack those raising the issues about Mark Meckler, just attack folks that are brave and standing up to shed the light. Join the attack on Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern, Jen Rockwell and Pam Silleman, disparage and disregard them and what they say.

You are running cover for Mark Meckler, you help the "Meckler Protectors" here that disparage Mandy Morello by calling her a "Benedict Arnold" vs. addressing the issues these folks raise.

Instead of attacking these folks how about you ask Mark Meckler to show up and respond to the issues? Maybe you don’t want that to happen considering who your wife works for, that being Tom McClintock.

Yep, attack the folks that raise legitimate concerns about Mark Meckler, where the Tea Party donations are going, how Mark Meckler used the Tea Party membership list to reach out to the members seeking donations for his “Personal use”, ignore all that Mr. Pruett and get back to Tom McClintock and let him know you are working hard to help protect Mark Meckler.

It’s a shame to see the “Meckler Protectors” attack folks like Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern, Jen Rockwell and Pam Silleman, it’s clear who the real "Benedict Arnold" is and it isn’t Mandy Morello!

The solution?… Mark Meckler can respond to the issues raised here… right here and now… unless he has something to hide... which sure seems to be the case based on what has been exposed here.

Barry Pruett

I support everyone that is commenting here on their methods to get out the message about the Tea party movement. What I do not support is your (Enos') effort to divide the movement. All here need to know that Enos is a Tea Party hater whose only goal is to hurt the Tea Party. He has found a fissure and he is trying to exploit it.

I support the Tea Party and am not involved on the organizational level. Hell, I voted for Larry and was endorsed by the GOP Trumpter. My only goal in commenting here is to smoke you out.

Steve Enos

Well Barry... seems you might be smoking something all right and that isn't me or those raising important issues about Mark Meckler.

How about you denounce those folks above that have been bashing on Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern, Jen Rockwell and Pam Silleman for speaking out?

How about you name the folks above that have been bashing these folks trying to cover up the issues they raise?

How about you address the issues instead of trying to make this all about me? Barry I'm meaningless, it's the issues these folks raise that are the REAL issue.

How about you call Tom McClintock and have him talk to Mark Meckler and ask Mark to face these folks and the issues they raise... right here, right now!

I know you have a direct connection to Tom McClintock considering your wife is his rep here in Nevada County.

Try addressing the issues these folks raised Barry as it's not about me... it's about Mark Meckler.

Steve Enos

Over on Barry Pruett's blog there is a new post by Todd Juvnall, a "Meckler Protector" and Barry Pruett's buddy. This post claims the folks here raising the issues about Mark Meckler are... being paid to do so!

"After reviewing the numbers of TPP members, it is apparent they are a huge success. Mr. Meckler is a big part of that. I would say the critics of him are probably being paid illicitly to demean him and the TPP. Follow the money of the critics. August 3, 2010 9:48 AM"

This is so far over the top. So these "Meckler Protectors" say Mandy Morello is a "Benedict Arnold" and now Todd juvinall claims those raising concens here about Mark Meckler are "being paid illicitly to demean him and the TPP".

Yikes! They will stop at nothing and say anything to protect Mark Meckler.

Barry Pruett

It is plainly clear to everyone reading these posts. You have an agenda.

1. Destroy the Tea Party

I have an agenda to...

1. Fiscal conservatism
2. The Constitution
3. Capitalism

These disputes do not concern me, as I have but the three interests above. I will not pass judgment on anyone.

I do agree with you on one thing...Mandy, Larry, and Laura are wonderful people for taking time out of their lives to do what I do not have time to do. Let me be the first on this thread to thank them for supporting and working the Tea Party movement. Steve...please tell them that they are doing a wonderful job for our country by fighting for the ideals for which the Tea Party stands...

Steve Enos

Yes Barry they are... I have stood up to the "Meckler Protectors" here that have been bashing them and refusing to address the isues they raise... why won't you do the same?

I love fiscal conservatism and OUR Constitution. As an elected representative I was a hard fiscal conservative. I konw that the government uses ansd wastes the peoples hard earned money... the same hard earned money some say Mark Meckler is using for his gain. Mark Meckler should address these concerns here if he has nothng to hide.

I also like folks that claim to be leaders to be held accountable to the people they claim to lead. Mark Meckler is not doing that and eveyone here should be demanding that from Mark Meckler vs. attacking those that raise these important issues.

Jennifer Rockwell

Oh Barry - I don't know Steve or what his motive is, but I assure you...NONE of us (Mandy, Laura, Larry, Pam, me, etc) are going anywhere! As hard as Meckler tries to tear us down while trying to hold a tight grip on what he seems to think is HIS movement (and his alone), the harder we will fight to keep the movement alive and going full steam ahead!

Mark Meckler is merely a speed bump on the road that is this Grassroots Movement. Yeah, he might momentarily slow us down, but once we are over him, we are over him. Moving on!

Jen Rockwell
http://newreaganpatriots
iCaucus District 3 Coordinator

Barry Pruett

I am glad that you finally admitted to being a Tea Party supporter Steve!

Jen...sorry that I forgot to add you to the list. Thank you for your work too. I was making an analogy to the "Starfish" and intended no disrespect.

I have said my piece...have fun with the last word SETPS ("Steve Enos Tea Party Supporter").

Michael Anderson

Barry wrote re. Steve Enos:
"It is plainly clear to everyone reading these posts. You have an agenda.
1. Destroy the Tea Party"

Not quite. If I can be so bold as to speak for Steve E. (correct me if I'm wrong, Steve), he wants the tea party (lower case, embracing all the groups) to succeed in order to dilute the electoral power of the GOP. It's his belief that the tea party represents a radical fringe of conservative voters, and that as they ascend with unfocused political power the GOP-backed candidates will lose votes.

My opinion is that in the privacy of the voting booth, tea party members will vote overwhelmingly for GOP candidates. That's why the GOP just formed a Tea Party Caucus. Members of the various tea parties can talk all they want about being above the fray and non-partisan, but on election day they still have to vote for someone. That someone will most likely be the leading conservative candidate in a given race.

This long discussion eerily reminds me of some of the all-smoke-and-no-light debates back in 2000 when Democrats were losing their minds over Ralph Nader and various Green Party candidates who were diluting the liberal vote, which handed the presidency to George Bush. I wonder if members of the tea party are able to see the similarity.

I just checked the tally and Larry Naritelli received 2.3% of the Republican vote, third place behind Poizner and Whitman. Again, a lot of Sturm und Drang over a measly 24,033 votes.

Barry Pruett

Michael...point well taken as to Enos.

Again, I agree with you that Tea Party people will overwhelmingly vote for conservative candidates. The Tea Party ideology is one that embodies conservative philosophical thought (more so than the establishment parties who are all about power). I would love to see a conservative Democrat support the Tea Party. It just so happens that most conservatives are Republican or independent.

Paul Emery


A recent Gallop Poll shows that 80% of Tea Party affiliates are Republicans and have voted Republican in the last three election cycles. The poll indicates that they will vote Rupublican in the next election. 12% are Democrats and only 8% are Independents. This indicates to me that the Tea Party is the same Conservative faction of the Republican Party with a different logo.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/141098/tea-party-supporters-overlap-republican-base.aspx

Barry Pruett

By defintion, if only 80% of Tea Partiers and Republican and 20% are either Democrat or Independent (i.e. other parties), the Tea Party cannot be the "same old Conservative faction of the Republican Party with a different logo," because 20% of the members are not Republican.

Considering most Republicans are conservative, you would expect 80%. Considering most Democrats are liberal, you would likewise expect 12%.

The numbers do say one thing for sure...100% of the Tea Partiers are conservative in one way, shape, or form, and the TP clearly cuts across party lines.


Paul Emery

Here's more from the poll. You can read whatever you want into it.

"While Tea Party supporters are not universal in their backing of Republican candidates, they skew heavily in that direction. About 80% of Tea Party supporters say they will vote for the Republican candidate in their district, slightly lower than the projected 95% Republican vote among conservative Republicans.

This suggests that the potential impact of the Tea Party on Republican chances of winning in congressional and senatorial races this fall -- even if supporters turn out in record numbers -- may be slightly less than would be expected."

Todd Juvinall

Barry, what the detractors are doing is actually helping the Tea Party and the Republicans. By trying to sow dissension about the Tea Party and implementing the bidding of Pelosi/Obama/Reid I couldn't have called a better strategy for growth! And it is working! By trashing the Tea Party, Americans of good will, those that are tired of the lies and distortions of the left (thank you Obamacare)and all the left wing name calling, are being driven into the arms of the Tea Party. My experience with politics showed me that people will do the exact opposite to what these lefty's are trying to accomplish. Enos and the rest, by trash talking the real Americans, are being tuned out by those real Americans and they don't even know it. Anyway, there is more to the human brain than these liberals think and I say, let Enos and the rest just keep on trash talking, it is a great recruitment tool for America!

Michael Anderson

One thing for sure, the marketing arm of the tea party is ramping up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jEGt44JVj8

George Rebane

Are the TP members just Republicans working under a "different logo". This cuts to the heart of the TP movement. I have weighed in here and invite your thoughts.
http://rebaneruminations.typepad.com/rebanes_ruminations/2010/08/tea-party-member-republican.html

Michael Anderson

It's all about the moderates in American politics. Always has been, always will be.

I think this is a fact that a lot of tea party members are inconveniently forgetting. I don't begrudge the tea party their venting platform any more than I begrudged the Ralph Naderites or the Green Party in 2000 their venting platforms. Without our fringes there really isn't anything to discuss.

But at the end of the day, we have to vote for somebody. And that somebody is usually a moderate, someone who isn't going to get all crazy-wiggy on us. Someone who isn't going to jeopardize our livelihoods, someone who isn't going to lead us into unnecessary wars, someone who isn't going to suspend the US Constitution, someone who isn't going to besmirch our trust by bagging interns.

Now that I'm older, I realize that American politics is actually as simple as a game of Yahtzee (a dice game for ages 8-and-up). It's all about the middle and adding up the numbers. Jeff Pelline has been banging this drum all year, to his credit, and he's been taking a beating for it. But he's right.

Let's hear what Chuck Schumer has to say about it: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/08/02/100802fa_fact_toobin

Chuck writes: "To do health care was a noble, good thing, and it will help America dramatically...[But] seventy-five per cent of Americans have health care that they are fundamentally--I wouldn't say happy with, but not unhappy with it."

Chuck is the ultimate pragmatist. He fought for the middle in 2006 and 2008, and the Dems will do so again in 2010. The tea party has yet to address this simple electoral fact.

Barry Pruett

Michael. I agree with you. The political football game has historically been fought "between the 40 yard lines." It is currently a perception with conservatives Americans that Obama is trying to push the ball down to the 20 (on the left side of the field)...hence the blowback in the polls and the Tea Party movement.

That being said, there is a balance, like tug-of-war. You need to have the hard right to counter the hard left and vice versa. That is what keeps the ball between the 40's.

Todd Juvinall

Missouri voted 71-29 to boot Obamacare yesterday. Guess who carried the water for the ballot measure in the Show Me State? The Tea Party.

Steve Enos

Notice there is one person missing for this disscussion"

That would be Mark Meckler. Why doesn't the Meckler the "Leader" step up and respond to the folks raising issues here, conservative, hard working for the cause folks like... Mandy Morello, Laura Boatright, Larry Naritelli, Dave Kern, Jen Rockwell and Pam Silleman.

These foks have raised a number of real issues that Meckler the Leader should address... why no accountability required from Mark Meckler?

Jack Armstrong

As a retired Probation Officer I can read character and personality disorders and know when I am being conned. These people are detractors inciting internal conflict aligning with a small group that seeks power in the TP Movement. Outing leader Meckler is the game plan. They are fracturing the movement. They can post that they are leaders and founders all day long and not convince me .... they are new to the circuit selling themselves as fringe groups do. Just because they say so does not make it so and their intent is questionable.

Just a heads up to you good honest patriots, this small group has created "Citizens for Constitutional Liberty" a new political action committee(PAC) http://ccl4you.blogspot.com/ with Mandy Morello graduating into a partnership with Mark Williams, the ranting conservative talk show host who was ousted from TPE.

Mandy Morello, Sacramento Tea Party stated that "We have real work to do in order to help save this nation. There are still about 30% nationwide that are still under Obama's spell ....looks like the same rings true for the morons following Meckler". Calling patriots morons? I would not follow this person out of a fire.

Addressing the one that repeatedly self promotes is a concern. It is all about her. Honest and trustworthy people do not have to convince with pretentious self-posturing in an aggressive display. I read an underling threat in those posts. This is a con job.
CONDUCT: INTEGRITY, PRINCIPLES.
They ALL know me, and my integrity is UNQUESTIONABLE.
HONEST AND VERY, VERY FORTHRIGHT.
I don't solicit funds from my contacts.
"Want the whole can opened? Keep it up, TPP/Mark, and any name-callers that might pop up."
"I'd prefer to concentrate on exposing the REAL "Cracker Party"
"I know Alinsky tactics when I see them, better yet, I know how to wield them too."

Scary stuff using Alinsky tactics against American patriots that disagree. Don't give it another thought Laura Boatwright.

Journalists, lawyers, politicians hold threadbare trust ratings among Americans. They make poor leaders in the Tea Party Movement.

As Socrates said, "When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser."

Laura Boatright

@Jack Armstrong- "Addressing the one that repeatedly self promotes is a concern. It is all about her. Honest and trustworthy people do not have to convince with pretentious self-posturing in an aggressive display. I read an underling threat in those posts. This is a con job."

Hilarious! Ask Mark Meckler YOURSELF who I am.

Then, understand that when I brought true concerns about the focus and direction of Tea Party Patriots to him and other members of the board, he "went Alinsky" on ME!

HOOT of the day:
re: Todd Juvinall- "After reviewing the numbers of TPP members, it is apparent they are a huge success. Mr. Meckler is a big part of that. I would say the critics of him are probably being paid illicitly to demean him and the TPP. Follow the money of the critics. August 3, 2010 9:48 AM"

I just checked, I have 34 bucks in the bank. Yeah, knock yourself out "following the money." LMBO!

Mandy Morello

@Jack Armstrong- "Journalists, lawyers, politicians hold threadbare trust ratings among Americans. They make poor leaders in the Tea Party Movement." Like I said above, I have never called myself a leader nor have I pretended to be one... Mark (a lawyer) can't go anywhere without announcing he is the "National Co-Founder of the Tea Party Patriot."

I have been close friends with the Meckler Clan for over a year, but they are no longer the same people they were when we first met. The separation from them is so much more than a "business separation" this is very personal ...they were my friends and their betrayal to me and to other Patriots goes far beyond unacceptable, it is heart-wrenching that these people I have fought with and defended tooth and nail when they were being wronged, are so self-centered as to basically say people involved in making the TPP what it is today, never were a part of it!

As for Mark Williams, I was right with Mark and Patty when we attacked Mark Williams for his original post about Mark Meckler...because the movement was so new people didn't see Mark Meckler as the sole leader of the movement just a fellow Tea Partier and we saw it as an attack on one of our own. Williams and I(and many other Tea Partiers) have obviously moved past all that in order to get some real work done...in order to take the movement into action by unifying grassroots groups together, something Tea Party Patriots have never been successful at. If Mark Williams, "the ranting conservative talk show host who was ousted from TPE," was so vile and horrible, why is he still being asked to speak at events and host radio shows? The answer is because he is the only one that is willing to do what nobody else will do, Yell out the "emperor has no clothes!" I respect Mark Williams for what he has done for this country, Mark Williams is the true leader of the California Tea Party.I have never once heard him call himself the leader of the Tea Party movement or the leader of an organization...for business purposes he called him co-chair... but never called himself founder or leader. Mark Meckler didn't get up on the Flowerbed and get people riled up, Mark Meckler first spoke at the 2009 tax day rally but who got people to actually come to the rally? Mark Williams using his voice! Those are little known facts that we have let quietly fade into distant memory, kinda like the way our history teachers are trying to skew real American History.

As for "follow the money," Laura I think you are about $40 richer than I am!LOL

You want to follow the money, check this out and follow the money on your own:‎

1. I was told Sacramento/Nor Cal is asking for $2000 from individual groups to help fund this 9-12 rally... this rally is put on by the National Tea Party Patriots with help from the Nor Cal Tea Party Patriots.... National is receiving money from all the merchandise they sell and from the donations to their national website... they do not help individual group, nor do they help candidates, so where is the money going?

2. Here is the flier: http://media.tripod.lycos.com/preview/2044891/1024x1024-1284636.jpg

"McClellan Park will be selling food and beverages on site. Please, no coolers or ice chests will be allowed. Bring chairs, shade (any pop-ups need to be on the perimeter to allow everyone a line of site to the stage)hats, sunscreen and your signs! Other Tea Party groups are invited to set up information booths, but PLEASE, no merchandise or soliciting for contact information or donations. "
Tell me how are the individual groups going to grow if the national is the only one to collect names/donations or even help spread the word about what is going on in their neighborhoods?

3. The Donation video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qNEI6DxSFQ&feature=player_embedded this video is being seen on Youtube and sent around to their email list that they claim is over a million emails strong...even if they got half their email list to average $3 each (because some people will send more than $3) that equals $1.5 million.

4. The "300" donors that purchase tickets for $1000 and $2000 per rally- http://www.teapartypatriots.org/912/300.aspx That is $300,000 just for that one thing alone.

5. These events are staffed by "volunteers." The only "paid" person is Mark Meckler and Jenny Beth Martin and the hard costs that the stage sound and video tech people will be charging. The entire 2010 Tax Day rally cost $32,929. This covered everything from advertising on Rush Limbaugh/Sac Bee to Jumbotrons to Insurance and Porta-potties.

6. These totals above only touch on this one rally. This does not include the merchandise or donations they collect on a daily basis. The TPP do not help candidates, so what is all this money going for? They do not have a paid staff, so what is all this money going towards? Individual groups...I don't think so! Pam Silliman from Napa Tea party received an email that one of the groups asked her how to be a non-profit and (not being a lawyer herself) replied call Mark Meckler - they paused, said they had and he told them he would help for a fee!

7. The National/State and Nor Cal TPP tells all the groups that they are a 501(c)4 organization so they cannot back candidates.... fine but that non-profit status does not cover individual groups! If you want to get involved with a candidate in your area and endorse a candidate, get involved and take action in your area! TPP says they do not want to tell people how to vote for candidates, but they have no problem telling you how to vote on issues. A group was quoted as saying "98% of the Statewide Coordinators agreed not to endorsed candidates because they do not want to back anyone because they do not know what they will do after they are elected." in addition to that statement, " If we hold out from endorsing the candidates, we will still be in control and have their ear." NEWSFLASH TPP- the election will be there if you vote or not, I for one want to make sure the most conservative candidates gets elected. This mentality gave us Meg Whitman as the GOP nominated candidate for Gov..who's ear do they have now? As for the comment about having power and the ear of the candidates, guess what candidates only listen to those that help them get elected. You don't help YOU HAVE NO POWER! Think of it as the guy or girl you wanted to date, if you continually snub them and think you are too good for them, they move on!

This is just off the top of my head about where our Tea Party movement is going and why I, and soooooo many others have left.

The true difference between Tea Party Express and Tea Party Patriots-

Tea Party Express tours the country rallying people around candidates in order to actually make change. They collect money in order to do this. Commercials, ads etc cost money, there was never a debate about that. My problem was that when they did the tour, the money raised did not go to help put on these rallies by small local Tea Party groups. As you saw above, these rallies took thousands of dollars to put on, the first tour Deborah said she only spent $250 on her half of the tour. To me, that is unacceptable and the rally coordinators should have been given more help.

Tea Party Patriots- not sure what they do anymore, except take peoples money in order to put on 2 rallies a year. They woke people up, but now that they are woken up, they are too chicken to lead! Unlike Tea Party Express, TPP collect money not to help the individual groups grow but instead turn around and sell the email list without people knowing!

If you are a Tea Party Leader, think for yourself and what you can do for your neighborhood or community. If you are a member ...DONATE TO YOUR LOCAL GROUP ONLY!!!


Laura Boatright

Let's not forget this Eagle Publishing ad that TPP took out (pdf available via email: laura.boatright@msn.com)- something that Meckler said he would NEVER DO, when WE began this movment:

[left column]
Tea Party Patriots
First Time on the Market!
96,084 Total Donors $125/M
82,278 Pro-Life +$10/M
73,228 Traditional Marriage +$10/M
Telemarketing +$25/M
The Tea Party movement has swept through our country and is
picking up more supporters every day. These individuals support
limited government, traditional values, and lower taxes. They will
play a key role in the 2010 Election as they are extremely motivated
to make sure liberal politicians will not get elected. They believe in
taking our country back to the way our Founding Fathers envisioned it
would be. Tea Party Patriots are willing to give their time, money,
and endless effort to help elect conservative candidates at the local,
state and federal level.
This is a must test for all anti-tax, traditional values, limited
government, pro-gun, and conservative organizations and
campaigns.
For more information, contact Zephanie Custer at ext. 468 or
zcuster@eaglepub.com.

[right column]
[logo- Eagle List Company
An Eagle Publishing Company]

Source Direct Response
Selections (Geo)
State/SCF/Zip $7/M
Congressional District $7/M
Senate District $7/M
House District $7/M
Selections (Demographic)
Gender $7/M
Income $10/M
Phones $25/M
Additional Information
Email Delivery $50/F
Minimum Order 5,000 records
Postal addresses and phone numbers
are guaranteed 99% deliverable.
Sample mailing piece or telemarketing script
is required for List Owner approval. All
rentals are for a one-time usage only.
Re-uses must be cleared by the List Owner
prior to mailing.
Orders cancelled before the mail date will
incur an $85 cancellation fee, $10/M running
charge, selection fee, and shipping.
Orders cancelled after the mail date must be paid in
full.
###

In the beginning, Meckler railed against other orgs who shared/sold email lists without specifically notifying the contacts of sharing their info with third parties. This isn't just their contact info, but DETAILED INFO of their level of involvement!!

So, Mr. Parole Officer, might want to reconsider who you "read" as trustworthy.

Laura Boatright

re: my last post- kinda puts a new light on this excerpt of #2 in Mandy's last post: "Other Tea Party groups are invited to set up information booths, but PLEASE, no merchandise or soliciting for contact information or donations." doesn't it??

Follow the money, indeed.

RUMOR has it that Meckler and Martin requested annual salaries of $141,000 at a TPP Board meeting in Feb. 2010. We'll have to wait and see TPP's tax filing to find out if that is true, but it came to me from a reliable source.

Now, before someone accuses me of jealousy, let me state that there are SO MANY boots on the ground local Tea Party organizers who are unemployed and some who are "this close" to losing their homes. They get ZERO SUPPORT, not even for their rallies, printing, websites, etc from TPP or CATPP.

Damn right I'm jealous....FOR THEM.

Laura Boatright

Let's just dispel the "newcomer" boloney right now:
http://www.infinitemonkeysblog.com/?q=node/6367

"The Rancho tea party, as well as an event earlier in the day in downtown San Bernardino, was organized by an energetic activist named Laura Boatright. She was thrilled with the turnout but slightly disappointed that no elected officials or chamber of commerce types bothered to show up. Maybe they knew they wouldn't be too welcome?

Boatright understands that the problem facing Californians and Americans generally is that we elected the people who brought us to this pretty fiscal pass. "You know how Harry Truman had that sign on his desk in the White House that said, 'The buck stops here'? Well, that's not true," Boatright said. "The buck stops with us... with the people. It's our responsibility to vote these politicians out of office."

Just google "Laura Boatright Tea Party" and see what you find...

PAM SILLEMAN

OOPS, Stan, I was in error:
please correct the following information:
NOTE FROM AMY KREMER, THE 'FOUNDER' OF TEA PARTY PATRIOTS;

Just so you know, I started TPP...not JBM...I brought her in to help, but it was all my brain child and I bought and paid for everything. I started it the first week of March and she didn't really help until April. As forf Meckler, I did not even know him when I started TPP!

They are crazy! I applaud you for your heart, soul, and persistence! You are an amazing Patriot!

Love you girl!

Amy Kremer
678.495.8271
Chairman, Tea Party Express


--- On Tue, 9/28/10, Pam Silleman wrote:


From: Pam Silleman
Subject: Re: Mark, please give the money back, you are dismantling our success! please!
To: "Stan Meckler"
Date: Tuesday, September 28, 2010, 5:37 AM

Hi Stan.
No Stan, Mark didn't start Tea Party Patriots, Jenny Beth and Amy Kremer did, They had never HEARD of Mark Meckler.

Mark was looking on and watching from the sidelines, he did ask to join them, then promptly started the division, ending in their pushing out Amy Kremer.

Since then they have continually used the donations brought in by the National website to fund various lawsuits on patriots like Amy. (and Jason Hoyt, who recently won that one)

Perhaps YOU need to know your facts "Stan".
I too was fooled by Mark.

Not anymore, Mark is the problem, he needs the TPP NOT the other way around.
As for sacrifice:? HA.

Mark, Jenny Beth etc draw SALARIES from the TPP and use $$ from trusting patriots to fund their personal travel expenses etc.
Sacrifice?

Nice try. I am not on salary like they are (no one else pays for my travel back and forth to DC, or our rally permits, dinners/airlines for guest speakers etc: that comes out of my own little pocket) , yet continually I have people sending $$ to TPP, assuming that we all work together and that somehow that money gets to help me and our local Tea Party.
Mark etc have never helped me one tiny bit.

Matter of fact I had spent over $10K on a huge rally earlier this year (May 22nd) it was Mark that called the DAY before the rally (out of the blue) and demanded that I fire Mark Williams as MC. He had not even taken the time to RSVP to this rally, yet at the last minute, he (with no concern about the movement or my risk) wanted to take over the entire function.

Of course, I had organized the entire production, had housing/dinners, rides etc all set up. Mark didn't care about that, all he cared about was that Mark Williams would be there and he is so jealous of anything Tea Party Express that he can't see rationally.

It didn't stop there Stan, the day after our rally, Mark Williams MC'ed at a rally in El Dorado HIlls for Chuck DeVore, that made Mark so mad that he wrote me and said that because Chuck was seen at the same function as Williams that the TPP must denounce Chuck Devore! If you would like to see these crazy emails I will show you Stan.

Mark is not about 'the movement', Mark is about furthering Mark. (I have seen his online begging for personal money) sick. As if we all have not given everything?

Many of the California coordinators are quite aware of his true motivations. I am sure you know of how he personally SOLD our database for $7500 to the GOP and put the money in his own pocket!

He is dedicated alright, dedicated to hold onto his income and power position with little regard for the fact that accepting this 'million dollar' mystery grant (in exchange for our members names and info) will shadow our credibility. To say nothing about SELLING OUR NAMES TO WHO? He won't say! I hope the coordinators are not that dumb.

If this donor was real, he would be helping everyone, not 'picking and choosing' the winners, based on Marks' opinion. (sounds like the Marxist in the White House to me)

Ask Mandy Morello how Mark blackballed her and cost her personally over $5K when he sent out an email to all TPP demanding that they not attend the debate she was putting on for candidates. Mandy will be happy to explain that one to you Stan.

We could have you talk to Alex Foster, she was accused of 'threatening' Mark. Mark told me that Alex was a racist, as he said she threatened to 'burn his kids in an oven'.......later, of course, I read the 'so called' threats and found that none of that was true. Check the FBI if you wish, Mark thought Alex's emails were so 'scary' that he called them in to help.

It is sad to see this, but 99.99% of the patriots are of one heart, and that is the true unselfish one we all share,.........all but a handful that have become more interested in personally enrichment and fame.

We know who they are. The ones that take money in, but won't open their books to their members, the ones that will not endorse candidates but will spend money denouncing them, (Delaware, right now!) Where does all that money go?

I just hope that coordinators are not fooled by this scheme. Mark has sold out the TPP trusting group, just like he did in California. It seems he realized 'heck if I can get $7500 for a collection of names gathered by hundreds of conservatives in CA, imagine what I could get for a national collection of such same minded individuals?'...I bet a million bucks.

The Tea Parties are NOT Mark Meckler, he is just a speed bump in the progress, we will continue. At least now, the country will see him for what those of us in California have already learned.

Thanks for your letter Stan, Pam Silleman
Napa Tea Party, founded February 2009.

--- On Mon, 9/27/10, Stan Meckler wrote:


From: Stan Meckler
Subject: Re: Mark, please give the money back, you are dismantling our success! please!
To: "Pam Silleman"
Date: Monday, September 27, 2010, 7:58 PM

I think that you don't have a clue how the TPP started and who is actually responsible as to how we got here. It was started by Mark Meckler and Jenny Beth Martin. It was their fire and dedication and sacrifices that made us the great organization that it is. It wasn't you or me. We just came along for this glorious ride. Yes, we all play an important role...NOW! For you to make ridiculous and unfounded charges demonstrates that you really have no idea what you are talking about. How much time have you given to the movement? How much have you sacrificed your family. What have you personally created for the benefit of this country? Stop and think! I have no idea what your agenda is, but it sounds very selfish to me. It doesn't sound like you believe in the Tea Party Patriots. If you think you can do a better job, start your own organization and see how many will follow you. I know that my 2,500+ members won't and neither will millions of others.
If you have no respect with what Mark and Jenny Beth have accomplished, just quit. You won't be missed. I guarantee it.

Please don't try to respond as I have blocked any future email from you.

Stan Meckler
Nevada County Tea Party Patriots

----- Original Message -----
From: Pam Silleman
To: Mark Meckler
Sent: Monday, September 27, 2010 5:26 PM
Subject: Mark, please give the money back, you are dismantling our success! please!

http://www.resistnet.com/forum/topics/grassroots-mark-meckler?id=2600775%3ATopic%3A2629702&page=2

Our member lists are not for sale.

The strength of the Tea Party does not come from any 'leader' or national organization. The power of the party is in individual LOUD local voices from each and every community.

Please do not destroy what we all have all worked and sacrificed so hard for over the last two years!

Please Mark, you are making us look bad..............STOP please STOP now!

Charlie Wilson

I attended the August 2009 Tea Party event at the NC Fairgrounds and became enthralled with Mark Meckler who gave an emotional speech that brought us to our feet. Mark Williams emceed the event and also injected a true spirit of patriotism into our thinking not felt for decades. Over this past year I have been following our local, regional and national TP movement and my chest swells with pride. I have so many new patriot friends reminding me of my days in Nam. What has bothered me during this time was the coming and going of so many from our local TPP without a mention other than they didn't fit. What didn't fit? After asking around more throughout our TPP movement I began to get information questioning where all the donations collected by Mark and Stan were going. No one wanted to pay disrepect to any of the TPPs so information was limited or suppressed. I had heard that some in the leadership were paying themselves plus traveling in first class and felt justified to do so. Something smelled. This morning a respected patriot friend sent me this which has opened my eyes: http://www.marktalk.com/blog/?p=11082.

I saw Larry Naritelli speak several times this year during his campaigning as the conservative candidate for California's governor primary and know he is an honest man and truthful. I believe in the Tea Party revolution and what we have accomplished so far but now I am convinced that some get involved to profit from it. The Mecklers need to leave the Nevada County TPP as well as step down from the national TPP. Obviously money corrupts. More can be found here: http://www.marktalk.com/blog/?cat=3415

I am so discouraged having been taken advantaged by The Mecklers.

Mark

Stan, Now I know where your loser kid gets it. You are a total liar and scoundrel.

Your family name should be "Arnold" and your family secret the attempted sale of West Point to the King.

Mark Williams - exposing your son for the crooked fraud that he is at www.marktalk.com

Brad Croul

Are we witnessing an "event horizon" as this “star” becomes a black hole?

Jack Armstrong

These chickens can't see their own back. Good example of the pot calling the kettle black. Sweep first in front of your own door.

Amy Kremer Chairman of Tea Party Express, Mandy Morello, Mark Williams, Laura Boatwright are in collusion to usurp the Tea Party Patriot organization. Each of you has bad marks on your short careers in the patriot movement.

Creating division in the movement for a power grab within the Tea party Patriots. We would expect this from a mole not from patriots. They are trying to create confusion and discredit breaking leadership within the TPP to weaken the social and political infrastructure. These disgruntles want the TPP reins and bank account. That $1,000,000 donation is bringing them into the light of day.

We found further evidence of their battle plan to ruin the Tea Party Patriots... the largest established group that has not joined the questionable Federation(NTPF)
http://www.thenationalteapartyfederation.com/
This is getting personal and nasty
http://www.teapartyie.com/news/the-800-pound-thug-gorilla-in-the-room-tea-party-patriots-

Steve Enos

Looks like a number of Tea Paerty "first founders" were right about Mark Meckler, check out this story for details:

http://motherjones.com/politics/2010/10/tea-party-mark-meckler-herbalife

Mark Meckler... running the Tea Party Movement like a Pyramid Scheme to line his pockets. Seems those on the inside of the Tea Party that posted here are correct.

Time to wake up... Mark Meckler has been using the TEa Party for personal power and personal gain.

Todd Juvinall

Mother Jones is a commie publication and has no credibility except with fellow commies. Meckler is a Patriot and his family seems to me be be a typical American family. Mother Jones works good if you are a fan of the old USSR or present day Cuba.

Steve Enos

When you have Mother Jones AND a number of Tea Party first founders saying the same thing about Meckler... it's not a lefty lib thing!

One just needs to read the posts under this story and the Mother Jones story... no tea leaves needed, Meckler's time is running out. The national media is now on the story and the issues raised by Tea Party folks right here on George's blog!

EXIT QUESTION: How long before Meckler is ran out of the Tea Party movement?

Tick... tick... tick

Barry Pruett

Steve...you are either an incredible comedian or you should be committed! ROFLMAO. If this is the best you crackpots can do to tarnish Mark, that clock of yours will run out of batteries before Mark disapperas.

Bob Hobert

You people ALL need to take a cold shower. Are you actually reading each others' posts or are you just busily rewriting your last inane screed? I sure as heck am not going to wade through any more of your Bloviating Scandalmongering. Any election issues you'd care to comment on??

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