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« The Sheeple Diverted (again) | Main | Brexit Ripples »

24 June 2016

Comments

Jon Dozer

Echoing our thoughts precisely, this just out, mere seconds ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/24/opinion/brexit-and-europes-angry-old-men.html

jon smith

Dozer, I have to wonder when we become old men if we'll become angry too? We're they born grumpy and narrow minded, or is it part of aging like dementia, sclerosis and erectile disfunction? I've known Todd long enough to know that he was a blithering idiot 30 years ago and Bessee is just too plain bovine to really count for much of a trend. George, Russ, Idaho, fish, Tozer, Dirtdigger and the others, I just don't know.

All that aside, I can clearly understand the Brexit. Having lived in both Irelands and seeing so much frustration, rage, and helplessness that I could have ALMOST seen it coming, but really didn't believe it would happen. I do believe the EU will not survive in its present form. The mortar in the wall is no longer cracking, a very large brick just fell out.

George Rebane

There are many routes to a peaceful, commercially integrated, defensible Europe besides an ever-bloating and more sclerotic central government in Brussels. And there is no hope of finding such a route through ministrations of the unelected EU bureaucrats.

And yes, different demographics have seen different amounts of life and possess different sets of knowledge. By any metric today the younger (especially millennial) generations cannot demonstrate that they have climbed higher on the intellectual ladder.

Jon Dozer

LOL Mr. smith re: the local characters. In your Irish years was the frustration really mainly due to the EU or more entrenched, provincial Irish issues? Ireland and the North have been greatly enhanced by the EU according to every analyst I've read. I've seen multiple people say the EU and its economic boost was one of the factors to alleviate the acute tensions and violence of the Troubles. Ireland obviously went overboard with its newfound capital in the last decade, but came out of the financial crisis fairly well because of a pretty diversified economy. I think re-unificiation is a definite possibility and perhaps a necessity, due to the loss of economic power with this break. Either that, or back to an era of the insane and irrational violence...I think the Irish have a taste of a better life now, and am hopeful.

Jon Dozer

"By any metric today the younger (especially millennial) generations cannot demonstrate that they have climbed higher on the intellectual ladder."

Perhaps not, but the all knowing Father Knows Best never ends well for young people with their own ambitions and dreams of the future. Look what happened in the US, post 1950s. The EU was deeply flawed from the start, but the young saw enough of its positive side to understand the benefits through amendment, not full rejection. A sad day for Britain.

Gregory

Imagine for a moment what politics in the USA would be like if the Congress was unable to actually write proposed laws and submit them as a bill; and instead, only had the power to make minor modifications to bills written by the Executive branch. Obama supporters would love that as long as an Obama was in the oval orifice. Not so much if the other guys were in control but, it's also possible the folks in real control would be the permanent bureaucracy that sprang up to keep themselves in beans and tortillas.

That's pretty much the case in the EU and while the usual big government boosters here obviously think that's ideal, I'm surprised the more sane inhabitants of the cradle of democracy (Britain) ever put up with it in the first place.

Brexit might be more akin to a Magna Carta part deux.

Todd Juvinall

jon smith | 24 June 2016 at 03:20 PM

You cannot even blather intelligently. No one here is angry. You are the angry ones. You and your Dozer ilk. The other posters here were all quite calm when they ran their businesses, raised their families and contributed to the community and made money for themselves and the country. And they all did productive things for others (like Scoutmaster Bob Treiberg in today's Union). Unlike you takers we on the right supplied the money for your toaster and TV's, and paid your section 8 housing stipends.

Lastly, you should be embarrassed for not being a patriot and always carping against those that are. I have never met you and if I do you should bow down in my presence for paying your way. Jeeze you are a sad sack.

Jon Dozer

"No one here is angry." Todd J

Wow Todd, that's funny. If so, could you (or any of your very calm ilk) please calmly explain why you so heartily and enthusiastically support an angry guy for President who readily admits he taps into the anger of your ilk, who's very campaign is built on anger of angry older, less educated white Americans? Hay, it just seems a bit weird for a calm, satisfied, zen-like guy like yourself to be in the angry, uptight, charlatan's camp, dontcha think?

Jon Dozer

BTW Todd, on a positive note, the first word that comes to mind when thinking of you is NOT angry. Hey, that's something!

fish

Posted by: Jon Dozer | 24 June 2016 at 04:40 PM

I can't just help but think that both you and "Jon Smith" would be much happier discussing "erectile dysfunction" issues over at jeffys. It's so much more calm, serene, supportive and non-threatening.

A Safe-Space™ if you will, for you oh so sensitive lads.

And frankly he needs the traffic.

Gregory

"Jon Dozer", who are you today, Jeff Pelline, thrown off this blog for being an angry ass, or Steven Frisch, thrown off this blog for being an angry ass? If you're some other angry ass, let our host know, preferably eye to eye.

Both Pelline and Frisch are angry (and pudgy) old white guys who count on having the undereducated young and gullible carry their flag forward, because no one else will.

The old saw about the young who are not socialists having no heart, and the old who remain socialists having no brain, is borne of wisdom, not Alzheimer's. Today's young are getting screwed and what the gray hairs owe them is dying gracefully without clawing the wealth of their children and grandchildren into the grave with them. It's the last task of the Boomer generation.

Jeff and Steve, you go first.

Todd Juvinall

Fish it is fascinating the Dozer never posts except here. He does not want to post on his pwn blog I guess. I think I am not going to red his tripe anymore anyway here. He is too angry and petty and a waste of my keystrokes.

fish

Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 24 June 2016 at 05:00 PM

But Todd....it's so much fun.

George Rebane

For the record if anyone wants to check - the EU government has grown enormously in size, bureaucratic complexity, and regulatory overreach. And in its lifetime Brussels has become adept at dodging the tough issues of governance and resolving the hard questions required to conduct a prudent integrated economy. That (un?)fortunately is common knowledge among the EU members, and it has Brussels very scared about the fall of more dominoes. Of course, there is nothing new in this for the students of governance, it was ever thus.

jon smith

GR 5:27
Despite you being an angry old man (insert smily face) I agree with your every word on this issue. The EU in its present state will either explode or implode with the result being the same. At its inception, the notion of a strong EU was noble endeavor; however, once it was hijacked by the self serving Euroelite, it entered into the realm of a clearly non-sustainable Ponzi scheme. That it would fail was never in doubt, but the time frame is faster than I ever imagined. The refuge issue was the unanticipated catalyst to the collapse.

Bill Tozer

Agree with jon smith @ 5:53 pm.

I am sure the same economic issues that the British citizens face are the same issues the colonies faced when debating whether or not to break away into the unknown....all unknown except self determination. It's up to Germany now more than ever to keep the Euros flowing in Greece because Greece cannot survive one single day without borrowing money to pay for today, yesterday, and tomorrow. They just cannot make it a week without the EU's charity (other people's money), Time will tell if the dog returns to its vomit, but I digressed off my point I wish to make.
Self determination is more important to me than the pain of economical (fiscal) pain. Live free and all that stuff that pounds within the breast of all mankind. The spirit that calls out "Give me liberty or give me death" is not a queer over dramatic expression of centuries ago. No one chooses to be a slave to another, albeit a broken spirit and being too busted up inside to fight another hour causes many to say "no mass". They ran out of bullets, out of hope, their human spirit crushed and defeated. They submit to their overlords, their masters, their tyrannical rulers from distant shores.
What price can one put on the spellbinding awe watching the sun sinking over the horizon like a ship at golden hour? What price can one put on self determination? That price is expensive, requiring the willingness to pay the ultimate sacrifice if necessary....not just for oneself, but also for the liberties of our fellow man.
The unelected bureaucrats in Brussels will never comprehend or apprehend such a concept. Life is more than a job, 3 hots and a cot. Never have, never will wrap their heads around "rebellion". The nail that stands up gets pounded down by the Globalists.

Even Marx allowed much room for the workers who own the factories to become self determined self regulating independent cells with little need of a bigger authoritarian government. Looks good on paper, but somehow that self determination is swallowed up by the insatiable appetites of the never satisfied Big Bro. Big Bro's increase becomes life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' decrease. The leftists like it that way.
I am reminded once again of the list of grievances against the Crown contained in The Declaration of Independence. One need not read far to find the grievance that the King failed to protect his subjects from savages. Millions of individuals in Britian, Scandenavia, and Western European nations are expressing the same grievance....only in their case the savages are being imported into their midst without the citizens say in the matter. They cannot even utter the tribe of origin of the savages. Unelected bureaucrats in Brussels knows best...
Self determination had its risks and no guarantees. Uncertainty looms ahead for Britian. There may be short term pain, duh, Like a young person packing up and leaving home, they would go through anything to call their own shots. No home cooking awaiting them, no having mom do their laundry. Small and large sacrifices required to be self determining to them. School of hard knocks await. It's the way it

George Rebane

Good thoughts gentlemen.

Jon Dozer

"One need not read far to find the grievance that the King failed to protect his subjects from savages. Millions of individuals in Britian, Scandenavia, and Western European nations are expressing the same grievance..." Tozer

Lets see, native Americans circa 1770=savages, Muslim immigrants to Europe=savages.

sorry Bill. Racism easily detected. You don't even make it tough with code words.

Walt

I hope some of you listened to the Tom Sullivan show today. Then you might have heard some of the insane rules and "laws" that were imposed on the Brits by Brussels. Electric tea pots were banned. the jewelry and shoes a hair dresser was allowed and/or forbidden to wear. Just two off the top. Brits don't allow killers to vote, but Brussels stuck their nose into that too. The "killer" was a citizen of the EU!,, and demanded a chance to vote,,and got it. And you wonder why the Brits are peeved?
I see this as just a start to the end of the EU. The EU was a bad idea from the start.

Jon Dozer

Forget Sullivan, Walt. Read and learn. Drumpf's chances did not improve x3 as you said last night. We don't have the EU issues here in America.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/25/us/politics/is-brexit-the-precursor-to-a-donald-trump-presidency-not-so-fast.html

Jon Dozer

Walt, I think you misspoke. Its OK, easy mistake today. Brexit very, very confusing.
Here's the deal- No, the EU was actually a GOOD idea from the start. As proposed by none other than..Winston Churchill. Churchill declared the concept GOOD, OK? Good. Now then..the details and nuances of the membership were severely flawed. Without a central government, it was doomed.
Inevitable moments in history are now occurring.

jon smith

Walt 7:52
"The EU was a bad idea from the start." Absolute fucking off the top of your head bullshit. Quote me a SINGLE reference that didn't believe this was the best chance to rebuild a cohesive Europe post WWII. It was the best they had to work with but it got corrupted along the way. You obviously know nothing about the history of era and are jabbering like a rabid ditch digging idiot with a degree in???? Yep. Got me going on that one. I too, "don't suffer fools lightly". And (on this issue) you are a fool. I don't hold this against you on some other issues like firearms.

Todd Juvinall

Oh those angry jons. Idiots

Bill Tozer

Jon Smith....call it racism all day long. Muslims do not equate to savages. Islamics do. Pissing down a special needs 5 year old girl's throat by immigrant kids who are forced upon a community by our Great White Father in Washington is a savage act. Savage acts is what savages do. It's not the color of their skin, it's their actions.
Was it Emerson who said "what you do speaks so loudly I cannot hear what you say." The Apple does not fall far from the tree. Kinda like that Tailban guy in Orlando. What his son did was a reflection of how fall the apple falls from the tree.
I am exempt from being called a racist because I am a person of color, the opposed class. You need to understand me, I don't have to understand you. One way street. It's all your fault. Dr. King was wrong. :)
Seriously Mr. Smith, self determination and sovereignty require a say in all immigration. The vetting process will never reveal if someone has love in his/her heart for their new adopted country or evil. Can't be done. Some flee for their lives whohave no choice. They must leave their homeland. What is in their heart cannot be vetted. The stories of Muslim immigrants from North Ametica (Libya, Morocco come to mind) on those life rafts crossing the Medeterrian Sea and once discovering there are Christians in their midst, the Christian men and children are tossed overboard to drown in the deep blue sea. The women are then gang raped. I said to myself, "My God!, they (Europe) just took in poor refugees that are murders and rapists!! Holy shit, this can't be good." Sure, bringing in 850,000 single borecd men of soldiering age is not exactly the "women and children and families" the media portrayed. Yes, I be a racists but you are not allowed to notice that. :). It's White Privelges fault, lol.

We are not compelled to take in anyone, albeit no nation on Earth takes in as many new immigrants from every corner of the Globe on a yearly basis....by far as does the USA. There is no nation even close to matching our open heart. Still, wisdom prevents me from picking up a rattlesnake and sticking down my pants.
Brexit is not about racism. It's all about having their Parilement and elected officials calling the shots...a very rowdy and disorderly Parliment to the eyes of the outsider, as you are well acquainted.

Todd Juvinall

I just realized Norway was never a member of the EU. I wonder why? Hey JSmith, what gives with Norway?

Gregory

"Without a central government, it was doomed."

Bullshit.

Just because Winston Churchill blessed the concept does not mean what was actually built didn't deserve to be taken out back and shot. In retrospect, letting the Belgians get their hands on the EU, considering what a bunch of imperious self centered bloodthirsty bastards they were in their colonial period, probably doomed the EU to implosion sooner or later.

Really, "Dozer" you should be ashamed to be you.

Walt

WOW!! A "two holer" crapper. (a "jon" and a John joined at the hip)
Who will be next to say "FU" to the "EU"?
Giving up one's sovereignty was such a GREAT idea. Only our resident Commie bastards would believe that. Buckle up kids, it's going to be a fun ride. With any luck, our two jons will get so pissed when Trump wins they will move to Cuba. Go whine to the Castros.

I hear Trump has plans to end the free money to VARY questionable non profits. Especially those where the idiot running it is lining his/her pockets with big salaries.

Walt

Need another history lesson asswipe "jon"? WE the U.S. rebuilt Europe after WWII. It was doing just fine before money hungry "elites" came up with that grand scam. Now they are in more trouble than ever. The "rich" counties are sick and tired of paying the way of the deadbeat counties. Not to mention getting "ruled" by the unelected. Kinda like here with the EPA, a corrupt DOJ, a lawless White House, and every LIB run alphabet soup bureaucracy.

So Both you bastards(if not one in the same) can make an appointment to kiss my ass on the certerline of Main St. at high noon. Yup this ditch digger's ass will be good and sweaty for the occasion. Be sure to use plenty of tongue.

Walt

Bullshit?
Enjoy the moose turd pie.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/12175832/Fearing-Brexit-Brussels-pulls-plug-on-kettles-ban.html

Walt

And a steaming cup of Troll piss to wash it down.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2127464/High-heels-cut-size-new-EU-proposals-forcing-hairdressers-wear-non-slip-flat-shoes.html

Any more smartass rebuttals and denials?

The report from Sullivan was right. So shove that up where the sun don't shine.

Don Bessee

General of the Army George Marshall and Winston Churchill would have been at the front of the Leave EU line if they saw what the socialist apparatchiks have done to their vision. A vision that was designed to be the counterweight to Stalin not a new collective utopia experiment.

DefenseOne a national security wonk site that leans a little left had an interesting analysis of world polling that is a warning to the establishment elites. People have a very refined sense of threats to their well being. The 0 and euro socialist narratives fail that test. Their conclusions are presented as a warning to their establishment buddies in DC to stop trying to convince voters that global warming is a greater near term threat than ISIS and open boarders. Then you throw in the anemic American economic growth under 0 while he is flooding the country with people who will compete for jobs with folks kids. Its not that complicated. People in Europe and here do not for a minute believe that bringing single, drat age men from war zones or teenage gang bangers in unchecked and giving them asylum benefits is good in any way. People are asking why no Christians from Syria?

All madam liar liar pansutis on fire offers is her 'experience' as a reply to todays new reality. I hope she keeps owning the disaster her and 0 have foisted on civilization, all the way to Nov. ;-)

George Rebane

Somewhat surprising to see how our Left still puts undiminished faith in polls and pundit pronouncements on this side of the pond after their European counterparts have proven to be so inept in the practice of those trades. Perhaps it's the water.

Jon Dozer

Walt, that's so very Christian of you. I know how pious you pretend to be.:)

Oh boy guys, I gotta tell ya- I feel just terrible now not to have a non-descript-nobody like Gregory's approval of my thoughts and opinions. How absolutely devastating not to have the respect of someone so undistinguished as Gregory. Greg, what can I possibly do to find favor within your wise and respected brain. I will never be complete without your approval! I may not be able to sleep!!

Paul Emery

Don

What David Cameron and the Board of Supervisors have in common is that they were both sure they had the votes in their pocket when they came up with Measure W and the vote on the EU. Both regret they took that path for sure.

Don Bessee

PE, that's lame, there could be a joke in there somewhere though. ;-)

Jon Dozer

"Then you throw in the anemic American economic growth under 0 while he is flooding the country with people who will compete for jobs with folks kids." Donnie B

flooding the country with people... FALSE
anemic growth under zero percent... FALSE

Time we always call out the total Bullshit being spouted on this forum. We know you don't like a moderate black President, Don. Just come out and say that. Don't make up stories to cover the real reason for your hatred.

Thanks.

Walt

What the Hell do you know about ones faith you Atheist somebitch? You have no room to judge. Just because I have faith doesn't make me a monk.

Now how bout those facts I gave you,, you said were BS? So eat sh** and bark at the moon.

And to add insult to that injury,,
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/683224/END-OF-THE-EU-Germany-France-Austria-Hungary-Finland-Netherlands-Europe-Brexit

OH YAAaaa smartass,, who is going to bail next?? So go pound sand.
As warned before.. NEVER doubt me. Facts Trump your Progressive horse shit every day.

Jon Dozer

calm down Walt. Not what I expect out out of a god fearing Christian dirtmover.
I take it you haven't started a practice of yoga either? :)

Walt

One again the outhouse with a mouth spews BS.. Show those facts. Your opinion is less than worthless.
Importing "refugees" by the thousands is far from "zero". Allowing illegals to flood across the boarder, and NOT deport them, is also far from "zero" Miss Obummer's speech on that when he lost in court? In other words, " I don't give a shit what the court just said."

Prove otherwise lowlife....

Don Bessee

The 'jon' 952, WOW that's awfully dark lord of liberal lament land of you! LOL ;-)

Walt

You let me worry about "my faith". I will get a decent burial. You rate being fed to the buzzards. How come I believe they will turn down that free meal....

Bill Tozer

Mr. Walt @ 9:20 pm.
Walt, I had no idea Brussels was so dense. Messing with the Brits' tea and toast is worse than anything fact or fiction under the sun. You just don't ever ever to that. That's crossing the line. Off the charts stuff. Heck, that is even carved in stone. Unbelievable.

Their ancestors (the Yanks) went ape shit and dumped tea into Boston Harbor (dressed as savages) and the rest is history. No messing with tea time. Toasters that can't make a real slice of toast? Nuff said. No further research is necceary.
Nuff say, enough my ears can handle. TEA Party? Toasted Enough Already? How friggin dense can Brussels be?

"We are constantly told leaving the EU is a leap in the dark but the real unknown is just how much more depressing and grim life will be in the homogenised, soulless EU. They are already taking menthol out of our cigarettes, next they'll be saying oil of bergamot causes cancer and Earl Grey Tea will be no more."
"Brussels is storing up all barmy regulations, power grabs and budget demands it can delay until after the referendum," added Robert Oxley, a spokesman for Vote Leave, "But if we vote remain quicker than you can boil a kettle the same damaging proposals will be back on the table and we will be powerless to say no."

That guy nailed it. The libs and the entire left always always always peddle dull gloom "depressing and grim life in the homogenized soulless...." Yep, that is socialists and progressives' description to a tee. That is all they got. Soulless gloom depression. Great link there, Mr. Walt.
BTW, "be sure to use plenty of tongue" leaves the reader with a wealth of wonder and serious sense of purpose. Carry on.

jon smith

Tozier 8:32
"Jon Smith....call it racism all day long." Huh? WTF are you talking about? I was defending the birth of the EU. Where did you find anything about racism in my comments?

For a group of people who pretend to be so worldly, I find your comments laughable. Mr. born and raised in Penn Valley is a self proclaimed expert in world views? I was raised throughout a cross section of nationalities and have worked in Europe 2-6 times a year, every year, for the last 30 years. Your "world view" is unfortunately the American view but only you are so self absorbed as to not know it. Just one question, how many languages do you speak? My guess is two. American and English.

Jon Dozer

Spot on Mr. smith.Have a good night jon.

As for the rest of you-
RAGE ON!

LOL.

Walt

Well Smith, what happened to your move to the great land of LIBS up North?
I too have traveled and experienced the wonders of this third rock from the Sun. You don't have the monopoly here. Just because my chosen profession is changing the landscape doesn't make me stupid.
If you think things are better in some other nation, MOVE. No one is stopping ya'.
Brussels seems like the place for you. Enjoy... ( Now we wait for all the excuses why he won't)

Bill Tozer

Dozer never tires of trying to shame people. Like rust, his attempts never sleep. Wonder how his shaming the Bonanza Market into taking down their non local "Kangeroo Jerky" sign down is going? I feel his pain. How can one enjoy a fruit smoothie with that sign starring you in the face from afar. What will tourists think? Shame, shame. Bad retailer, bad. Mr. Dozer's offspring might even see that Kangaroo jerky (and gator and buffalo jerky) sign and that alone might scare off youngins along with future millennials. Shame, shame, shame. Does not represent Frisco values I suppose. Not Nevada City friendly. Oh, if only the EU and everybody would just line up under his control, life would be grand. Must be frustrating unable to keep all the ducks in a nice row. Now I feel the EU's pain.

Gregory

"Jon Dozer"/Jeff Pelline/Stephen Frisch

I see you're punching below your weight again, "Dozer". You are ashamed to be you, aren't you, sock?

Since you've chosen to go full frontal ad hominem, I'd say you didn't have a rational counter and are reverting to the old standbys, like claiming Obama was a moderate and anyone opposed to him just hates his skin color.

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.


Barry

Russia turned into the Soviet Union and the Russian people did nothing for the most part. I know the example does not come close to describing the US people. Russian culture vastly differs from American culture in terms of tolerance of authoritarian rule. My point is that most places in the world are more tolerant of such heavy handed ruling. I would think that Americans would be leading this Westphaliam movement.

Bill Tozer

Oh I see my error. Mr. Jon smith, my 8:32pm was in response to Jon Dozer's 7:51 pm, my mistake. Still get these jonjons confused. Wasn't talking to you, but you would not know that by my "Jon Smith" reply. Oh, was not born, raised, or ever lived in PV...yet. I speak fluent Espanol, American, a little Lakota, Kootanee., some indigenous languages of Peru, Colombia, Boliva and some Candian First Nations languages, but NOT fluently. A few but who really cares. I butcher English. Oh, my Spanish is not Mexican nor European. Different dialects everywhere you go. I hope to live in PV someday if I am lucky. If they let me in, that is.

Bill Tozer

Ah, technology is changing the way we communicate. Off topic.
http://thesmokinggun.com/documents/revolting/seattle-scanner-exposure-825693

Jon Dozer

"I hope to live in PV someday if I am lucky." BT Express

WHY in god's name would anyone aspire to that?

Jon Dozer

Definite parallels between the clusters of older, less educated Brexit supporters, and the SOJ types. Good piece today. The Economist echoes this idea as well.

For those of you with a solid GOP voting record, the result I believe could also echo in a long tenure for the Labour Party in Britain. David Cameron and other conservative GOP free trader, austerity types- GONE. I think you're going to end up with a bigger spending government, with fully funded social programs and transfer payments to those older, less educated folks. Is this what conservatarians really want?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/06/25/why-people-who-really-wanted-brexit-will-regret-it-most/

Bill Tozer

Ah, Mr. Dozer, we are drifting off topic. Perhaps we should spar over on the Sandbox where can exchange big hugs and butterfly kisses. Bring a long tongue and a open mind...

Jon Dozer

temporary drift...not interested in anything PV.

Bill Tozer

I am still digesting the Brexit. Was not very interested in the topic before or even the day after. Figured it was their decision, not mine. This event is a huge (uge) one. A biggie. May take a few months or a couple of years for it to sink in. I am still waiting for the day when every statue, building, highway, school, facility, and public building to tear down any reference to Bobby Klansman Wizard and fearless leader Byrd to be thrown into the dustbin of history. That shaking of his was so annoying and hard to watch. He was not one of the Beatiful People which is required in the entertainment industry known as politics.
The main point is the closeness of the vote. The elites look down their noses and say the children threw a temper tantrum. Throw the bums out. Heard the exact same thing from Tom Brokaw and just about MSM talking head, including that disgraced guy that used to be on 60 minutes. Not, not Geraldo. The older guy, the CBS newscaster. But such a close election result means that things will move slowly and no radical new directions or actions will be forthcoming. Already the shifting sand can be felt over here.
Brexit won by almost 4 points. On this side of the pond, that is called a mandate.
Looks like Obama will renege on his vow to put Merry O England at the back of the line. Obama did like Cameron, but both will soon be non-issues. The Brit leaves in October and the guy with the white radical socialist Marxist mother leaves office in January, so I figure wait a couple of years minimum and see if works out.
Boy, some EU bigwig said it will take 7 years to negotiate the exit, if that. And that "short" time period may be too optimistic. Ten years?
The British will no doubt be hit with a huge exit tax. They need to keep a stiff upper lip. Think NY is pushing for an exit tax of their wealthy fleeing the state and CA Dems have been kicking the exit tax idea for emigrants around also. Boy, everybody wants a stiff penalty (money, money, money) for leaving, so maybe the Brexit is relative here.
Breaking up is hard to do. And expensive. Divorce lawyers ain't cheap.

Gregory

And just who at WaPo is "Jon Dozer" citing today...(6:51)

Kim Soffen
Graphics and Wonkblog Intern — Washington, DC

There are certainly thought provoking editorialists at WaPo and young Miss Soffen might climb a rung or two in coming decades, but in the meantime her readers might consider that the Brexit process will indeed put into place trade agreements, and an analysis based upon an Iron Curtain encircling Oceania to keep European goods from entering Britain and vice versa is ludicrous.


John

Isn't it interesting that the "jons" and the fues, etc. always claim that those that don't agree with them are "less educated"? Apparently all that "education never taught them the difference between educated and smart. Maybe they will figure it out if they ever need to accomplish something and need a "smart" person to do it because all the "educated" can do is think and talk.
"Jon Dozer's/fue's skill set ends at the edge of "his" keyboard and he actually needs help putting on his socks. Or maybe "he" has become "smart" enough to wear slip-on sandals. LOL!

fish

Posted by: John | 25 June 2016 at 08:11 AM

I think you are confusing terms here. As an example, the subject(s) of your post love to go on "less educated" people. Those who have the temerity to disagree with them (him) on political matters. Instead I believe they (he) should be using the phrase "less credentialed". The FUE has a masters degree from an accredited university. He has educational credentials. However reading the offerings at his....ahem....blog as well as his rebuttals to comments made here during the two or so years I've been observing I don't see how anyone could consider him "educated".

fish

...go on about "less educated" people.


Meh!

Bill Tozer

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MMzd40i8TfA

fish

I wondered how long it would be until something like this was floated.....remember they will be allowed to vote "until they get it right".

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-06-25/not-so-fast-scotland-and-northern-ireland-may-have-brexit-veto-rights

George Rebane

I draw your kind attention to this post's 25jun16 update.

Walt

Fish. Kinda like here. When LIBS lose ballot initiatives they whine to judge after judge till they find one who will overturn the will of the people. "It's unconstitutional!"
The voters here in Ca. have been "F"ed over time and time again by the sore losers who didn't like the people's voice. Yet "they" are the ones who love to preach of the "democratic"process.(until it does not go their way.)

But where are those whining Lefties when their voice was "stolen" by Hillary and the Progressive elite? You know,, that "superdelegate" BS? Sanders never stood a chance.(just to be fair )

Walt

Dr.R. You mentioned in that update about the Brussels overreach,, and you could see the reaction from one here (who has head firmly stuffed where the Sun don't shine) who just refused to accept two examples of the overreach.(Pretty much said I made it up)
Then when confronted with proof, flat out ignores it, and changes the subject.
Now Why would Prog news be any different?
No Different than what they do to Trump. Good news, is their bad news.

Bill Tozer

Oh my, reading the ever growing flurry of comments from Fish's 10:59 post, they could be talking about overturning one of CA ballot initiatives or any issue. It's unjust! Who are you to say it's unjust? The Scots are arseholes! The Scots want to stay! The Scots had the lowest turnout in the entire vote! They won by fear mongering! The Breitxs lied! 50% plus one is democracy, duh, and on and on it goes. Feels just like being home.
The lively and robust comments did mention someplace I was not familiar with. Hmmm. Where is Sheepfuckistan? Is it near Wales? Carry on.

Bonnie McGuire

Bill Tozer | 24 June 2016 at 07:13 PM
Very good Mr. Tozer. I think there will be more and more nations realizing that money isn't the only solution to their increasing problems as a result of following orders from headquarters to get it. Same system going on here in America with local and state governments wanting Fed subsidy grant money for projects. In order to get it they have to do what they're told (disregarding those paying the taxes). Although everyone is taxed, taxed, and taxed and charged fees for specific things...the revenue winds up in General funds and wasted on unrelated things requiring the constant raising of taxes. So we've watched the Socialist EU nations suffering financially, and our own national debt climb into $Trillions doing what we're told by our global government and the international bank. A simple small scale comparison is racketeering...In this case, the immigration order they better not refuse? An order by those who are detached from it?

Bill Tozer

Have to disrespectfully disagree with Jon Dozer's 7:59 pm, June 24, 2016.
We don't have the same issues here as the EU??????? WTF, Dozer!

"Even with that in mind, the European Central Bank is limited in what it can do because these fundamental problems like the stagnation of real incomes don't have easy solutions, Greenspan told CNBC.
There's a certain amount that monetary policy can do, but our problem is fundamentally fiscal," he said, adding that this is true in the United States as well as "every major country in Europe."

Alan Greenspand went on to explain that stagnet wages were a big underlying problem....and growth in entitlements that were hurting capital investments, thus corroding the core of GPD. Plus the transfer of funds from the Northetn Eurozone to the Southern Eurozone. Too many interviews and links to list post Brexit.

In unrelated but equally important news over here, I respectfully disagree with the father who banned his son from eating at his own restaurant. Dad should have given the lad an alternative disciple. Very harsh. Well, I have no say in the matter either.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/06/25/rhode-island-restaurant-owner-fires-son-for-insulting-customer-as-fatty-on-bill.html?intcmp=hpbt4


Bill Tozer

More follow up. Let the people decide.
https://mobile.twitter.com/NBC10_Tony/status/745774297889771520

Now, back to Brexit. This is one time I wished I had tv. Monday Bill O'Reilly will put forth the argument that the Brexit vote was an emotional one, due to immigration. But not the racists residents against new immigrates. Nah. A better and more accurate angle that makes more sense. It was a emotional vote cause by lack of assimilation. Not immigration, but lack of assimilation. Like, parts of London you will never here a word of English spoken. And we ain't taking like our known landmarks like Chinatown, Little Korea, Jewish District, Alvero Strret..etc that are tourist traps. Nah, lack of assimilation.
O'Reilly will also argue the reverse of my argument about the Trump Effect. He will say that Trump had picked up on the frustration caused by the lack of assimilation sentiment across the whole of Europe for the last 10 years and it has caused the European Effect to come to America. I report, you decide if you are going to watch. I will watch some clips Tuesday. Racism or culture? Islamophobia or nationalism? Big Bro or Parliment? Borderless or borders? "God save the Queen" won out on this round. Simple. Pick up a Canadain coin. Whose face is usually on it? God save the Queen.


Jon Dozer

That's right Dozer. We are much different than Europe. USA is already a diverse melting pot of hundreds of different cultures, ie, multicultural America. There is no unique American culture going back 500 hundred years, its constantly evolving and changing. Perhaps we could return to the land of thousand native American tribes. Thats right, hundreds of cultures contained within every cosmopolitan area of this great nation. Huge diff. Some of the old line Euro countries are populated by a majority of nostalgic old timers who cannot deal with a multicultural nation.

Walt

Here is a fine example of the "jon's" idea of the new "melting pot".
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/06/25/obama-invites-18-7-million-immigrants-avoid-oath-allegiance-pledge-defend-america/
Yup Bring the problems you're running from here.

George Rebane

Walt 357pm - good catch Mr Branson. With every passing day it is harder to support the Republican Party. The Repubs should put the undoing of unconstitutional executive acts on the front burner, and pass other legislation only as time allows. But to let this travesty pass without even a murmur is unfathomable. I would vehemently disagree that they have 'more important' matters to attend.

fish

Now this is interesting. We've been told that the flood of refugees from the middle east is an unalloyed good....both culturally and economically! Why then does the mayor of Calais want them driven to a recalcitrant England?


'Move jungle to uk', Calais mayor sparks furious row after demanding that squalid migrant camp be moved to Britain


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/1340224/calais-mayor-wants-french-migrant-camps-moved-to-the-uk-but-theres-no-chance/

George Rebane

fish 427pm - Now consistency and coherence has never been a strong suit in leftwing apologetics, and we witness demonstrations galore of this in these pages. Looking at some of the above, we also see that the Left does not share a common history with most Americans who have studied history. Since until fairly recently America did have a common culture as the one into which immigrants assimilated and exhibited in the public square. Now since that common culture has become politically incorrect, every other culture cum 'behavior pattern' is celebrated and encouraged equally within our shores.

Saul Alinsky and his mentors foresaw all this, and put into numerous 'how to' manuals to destroy America - a most prominent one is his 'Rules for Radicals'. Among one of their prescriptions is not to worry too much about logic and/or consistency in your arguments, the sheeple will neither remember nor parse them.

fish

Posted by: George Rebane | 25 June 2016 at 04:57 PM

Among one of their prescriptions is not to worry too much about logic and/or consistency in your arguments.....

The "jons" seem to have mastered that part of the curriculum.

Gregory

"Jon Dozer" is bullshitting again at 3:43PM

No, Jon/Jeff/Steve, the melting pot model is long gone in the USA... that's where immigrants immerse themselves into the American culture. The kids go to their neighborhood school and run like mad to learn American Standard English, just like all the Swedes, Norwegians, Scots, Irish, French, Serbs, Croats, Albanians, Russians, Afrikaner, Nigerian, Congolese, Filipino, Hindu, Cubano, Guatemalan and the rest (the exercise was getting old), even Estonian, and the kids in school helped their parents along, too.

And from what I've read, folks across Europe are pissed off at the arrogant bastards in Brussels running their lives. It isn't just immigration or even mostly immigration.

We have our own Bureaucrats Gone Wild! in the USA and I'd not be surprised to see something of a libertarian brush fire being lit to clear out our home grown thickets.

Todd Juvinall

Now the propaganda is saying there is remorse and a redo is in order. Yikes!

Walt

And some wonder and scratch their collective nuts why Trump has/will/is doing so well.
Like Mr.R stated above. Backing the GOP is getting harder to do by the day.(I figured that out a long time ago. The GOP is in it for themselves. NOT us working stiffs.)
Remember? Those running for office said "Give us the House and we will fight "O" and Co."
We did,, and Nuttn....The excuse was they needed the Senate too. " Elect us to take Senate and we will stop "O" in his tracks!". Now the excuse is,, "whatever we do, he will VETO it". Repubs have the power of the purse, yet won't use it.
The GOP has the ability to stop plenty of the rampant importation of those that don't like us, but won't. The PC crap has them running scared.
This is why I gave up on the GOP. At least most of the Hard core Tea Party elect have stood their ground. Like I said. "MOST" not all. The Tea Party needs to replace the GOP.. Not until something like that, and that line of Conservative backbone will reach change for the better come this way.

Gregory

The Scots just need some tough love... if you can't sober up and get to the polls you don't get a do-over if you don't like the result.

Paul Emery

The whole thing is just another example of the decline of the conservatives in Western civilization Population has reared its ugly head and dumped the establishment you once again The conservatives are taking the hardest with Trump and now the Brits

Paul Emery

That's Populism

Bill Tozer

Jon Dozer sez @ 3:43 pm.

"Thanks right Dozer". Hmm, great opening. I always figured he was talking to himself, now unequivolible proof. Yo Dozer, talk to the hand. Whip it good.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/article85877257.html

Paul is right. It is populism. Anger over jobs, stagnet wages, trade pacts, and immigration.

Bill Tozer

Paul nailed it:, part 2. Populism. Anger over the powerful elites propelled the people to grab the pitchforks in Britain. The people have voted to kick the powerful elites to the curb, then kick them down the street, past the city gates.
Heard the Dems blocked the Bernie Bros inserting anti-trade pact language in the Democrat Party Platform. Duh, that was a no brainer. The Dem elites see absolutely no problem here. Remember Hillary said she was the only outsider on the stage because she is a woman? That be the Dem version of anti-establishment, albeit her vagina is not quite as big as Dozer's.

Probably less to do with immigration than I first thought. Way less.
https://www.facebook.com/heritagefoundation/photos/a.178433669480.115841.21375324480/10154263405434481/?type=3&theater

Walt

Hay Paul. Maybe Canada should write and pass the laws for Ca., and we would have no choice or recourse but to follow. How soon would your fellow LIBS call for a vote to end that?
England wasn't "ruled" by their own,, an outside nation was telling them what to do.
And you blame the Conservatives? Hitting that cheap Irish stuff again?

Todd Juvinall

Paul Emery has it just backwards. We conservatives have always been for smaller government and less regulation. That is what has just happened in the EU vote. Paul must be mentally dyslexic to get it so wrong.

Bill Tozer

Come on guys, toss Paul a bone now and then just because. Paul got it right about populism. That's close enough. Now populism scares the holy hillarie out of our Divinely Ordanied Iron Fisted Out of Touch Rulers. Hillary is scared shitless of the voters, as well she should be. .

Bill Tozer

Re the update.
We would all be amiss to not acknowledge the great cartoon by RL Crabb. Picture is worth a thousand words.

Bill Tozer

This is a surprisingly good analysis from Fox.com. Not bad. Even Paul might like it...even RL, who knows? Can't take much for granted in 2016.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/06/25/nothing-to-lose-political-storm-churning-on-both-sides-atlantic.html?intcmp=hpbt1

Jon Dozer

Paul is confirming what I said this morning. The Brexit will result in a long tenure for the Labour Party after this initial PM election.
Reason is simple- the age of austerity in Europe is over. These angry old timer Europeans want benefits for themselves- the native nationals, they don't want any more cuts. Its been a brutal 8 years for Europe and its a big part of the reason they rejected the German-led EU, the austerity led EU.

Jon Dozer

George Rebane, you were starting to touch on this- but please address your views of this new paradox, with this new Euro rejection of traditional conservatism- free markets, globalism, outsourcing, free trade, austerity, etc. Yes, the Paul Ryan, Mitt Romney branch of conservatism that the GOP was touting so recently as the way forward for the western world. Is Paul Ryan and the Tea Party suddenly going to
reject their favorite austerity policies and unfettered free capitalism (ie, free trade, tax cuts, etc)? :) Curious your further views on this..

Walt

The "jon" is making another prediction. Count on this one being wrong as all the past ones.
And you're using Paul as backup? Poor Paul... As the outhouse with a keyboard would say,"mark the tape."
Funny how it was the Torys that was able to give the Brits the escape clause, or they would still be stuck in this disaster of a deal, with no way out. They need to build a statue of PM John Major in gratitude.

Don Bessee

There is condition related to very high cholesterol that causes memory dysfunction, among other dysfunctions. It either that or he is too well bathed in box chardonnay again. He obviously has no recollection of his past blathering's. It is nice to have a good giggle at the comic stylings of the 'jon' even if he did not mean it that way. LOL ;-)

Bill Tozer

Oh Dozer, that is such a small part of the puzzle. I do not except you to understand the larger picture. Never have, never will. Just wait for the Scots to realize their welfare benefits will be cut 40% in they join the EU...the UK was very good to them, much better than Brussels offers. But that is just a small sliver in the board.
Don't you think the British know what they are doing? Are they all that stupid? The leaders of the top two parties in England both hammered against Brexit. All the major media, the government, the economists, the pundits, experts, gurus.....the EU, the President of the USA, every major Western leader....the whole world came out against Trump...er, sorry, against Brexit for the last two months. Go ahead, struggle mightily to wrap your head around the election results. The voters spoke, time to move on.

Go ahead and blame White Priveldge or angry old bitter old angry old bitter angry old, old, old white people who are OLD and bitter. Have at it. Don't forget to say "old" and "angry" and combos of old angry til the cows come home. Throw in bitter and racism so it fits your narrow prescective.
Mr. Dozer, did you see any rioting, looting, assaults, arson, or bloodshed on the streets? That's why you don't get it. My ilk believesin the peaceful transition of power..your ilk believes in blocking public roadways, burning police cars, attacking keepers of the peace and peaceful voters, rioting, looting, bloodshed, and arson. Ok, that was mean. Sorry for grouping you in with those violent out of control degenerates. That wasn't fair. Nobody wants to be associated with that kind, even you. Sorry.
If I were to capsulize this many faceted event into one word, I would choose the word "freedom". Or two words: "self rule". Holy Smokes, England is still there the day after! Head scratching time....for you

"This is Western democracy in all its grandeur. It refreshes itself not with the blood of innocents, but with the peaceful passion of ordinary people. Raise another glass to freedom.
The parallels to America’s tumult are obvious — right down to the hairy similarities of Trump and mop-top Brexit leader Boris Johnson.
While the original Redcoats tortured rebels, killed their families and confiscated their lands, the new Redcoats in Washington and Brussels kill the spirit of innovation, enforce conformity with regulations and punish dissidents with charges of bigotry.
Elitists of both parties try to silence Trump by accusing him of “hate speech” for demanding that America control its borders and enforce its immigration laws. Similarly, Johnson was greeted with calls of “racist scum” first thing in the morning.

Johnson, potentially the next prime minister, committed the crime of suggesting that Great Britain would be greater outside the suffocating embrace of European Union bureaucrats. He favors a liberated country that can make its own laws and decisions, and put its own people first.

Jon Dozer

A very sick charlatan, stalking golf courses in Euro friendly Scotland. But this fraud too shall pass.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/donald-trumps-scottish-golf-swing-a-chaotic-two-day-trip-across-the-green/2016/06/25/296bfe40-3af5-11e6-9ccd-d6005beac8b3_story.html

Jon Dozer

Don, the comic stylings was your unbelievably drunken post of last evening. OMG. But you never told me how it feels to finish 7th in a field of 8, you being a respected County leader of critical issues...How does it feel Don? :) Honesty time, pretend this is an AA meeting.

Jon Dozer

Still waiting for someone to address the amazing paradox of the Brits now wanting the end of EU austerity, waiting for the money coming home to its born and bred nationals. Austerity is over, but anyone reading Euro publications and newspapers over the last several months can tell you that. And also, can someone tell me which high paying, good solid industrial jobs are coming back to Britain, which will trickle up to a new land of prosperity? The future young people of England are waiting on the answer...

Jon Dozer

"Don't you think the British know what they are doing? Are they all that stupid?" BT Express

The old geezers of Britain do not know what they are doing. Correct. They're pining for a time that will never happen again in history. They've screwed the young people of England, unless the 2+ million educated young Brits somehow get the do-over they require. Pity the young Brits, as I've said several times.

Todd Juvinall

"jon" step away from the vodka and go to bed.

George Rebane

Can anyone cite a credible source claiming that a majority of the Brits now expect Brexit to abolish their unsustainable socialism? What I've seen reported is that all they want is their own running room, their own self-determination. Nothing more.

Don Bessee

Time to flush the 'jon'. Would that be the 958p or the 1015p yesterday that have you befuddled? Its a shame you have moved to vodka from the box chardonnay. Hydrate and aspirins should help, listen to Todd .J.

Yes as it stands I am 7th, the fact is when I did papers to help the NCRP there was no expectation of a contested dist. 2 NCRP. If I had spent any money or time actually campaigning for that I might be annoyed but there were more pressing issues in Nor Cal. I will still be helping the NCRP, bad news for the haters.
I went 6 for 8 on June 7th. Big wins in San Jose and other counties for SAM Nor Cal, if you had not heard. ;-)

I have lots of friends in the rehab community that could help you if your ready to tell the truth for a change! LOL ;-)

Bill Tozer

Well, I say let the lush have his comfort. Go ahead, have a few more for me. Personally, I like being sober and sober minded, but I realize I am in the minority here. Oh yes, I feel soooo guilty for screwing over all the young people.....in the entire world. It's all my fault. It's all about me.....rightttttt. Paul Krugman (award winning journalist and Hillary droplet licker) hates austerity. Down right hates it. He may be right about firing up the printing presses to help the economy with fiscal policy. Problem with Krugman and Dozer, they just don't know when it is time to throttle back and pay the piper. Is Paul Krustyman still peddling Hillary's grannie panties online, or does he hoard them to use as a nice hankie to wipe the corners of his mouth????

Yep, our young people got screwed....by Obama's Homeland Security of all things. Go figure. Maybe the poor person of color intellectual can land a job in Brussels. I hope so.
https://pjmedia.com/homeland-security/2016/06/25/disgraced-homeland-security-adviser-mohamed-elibiary-scapegoats-egypts-christians-again/

Opps. That should have been posted under Corrupt Government or The Liberal Mind Interprets, or Liberal Pogo Stick, or Sandbox, or something. Sorry, a little bit. Have a nice hangover, Dozer. Join you?? No thanks, I have had enough of whatever is pickling your formerly functioning mind.
Question of the evening: when does a cucumber turn into a pickle? Take two aspirins and call me in the morning.

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