Sandbox - 16apr15

[Readers were starting to complain about the old sandbox getting a bit "stale" (some would have chosen a more robustly descriptive term, but then we do promote decorum on these pages), so we open a new one.  This day is propitious for another reason, today I brought home my fourth Jeep Grand Cherokee and bid a tearful good-bye to my last one, an unimaginably reliable vehicle that saw us through thick and thin, on/off road for thirteen years.  To me these cars have become as comfortable as a pair of old shoes, even though its designers (marketers?) try to foo-fooize the newer models with every imaginable button, beep, and display.  Hope this brand new baby grows up to have the legs of its forebears.]

Comments

[George Boardman]

You say your Jeep is getting too foo-foo? What do you expect from a car that's designed and manufactured by Italians?

[Bill Tozer]

Italians designed the Jeep Chief Grand Cherokee? Them olive pickers know a thing or two about Alfa Romeros as well. Now they are learning a thing or two about immigration.

http://news.yahoo.com/aid-agency-says-41-migrants-feared-dead-sea-142032667.html

[Bill Tozer]

Oh, I best depart on a happier note. Miss hyphenated last name is learning a thing or two as well. Guess she slept through check writing class at Journalism School, as well as a host of other essential classes.

https://www.yahoo.com/tv/s/msnbc-host-owes-70-000-delinquent-taxes-172503090.html

[George Rebane]

GeorgeB 348pm - Oh, you're a hard man Mr Boardman.

[Bill Tozer]

back with more happy themes.
It is not nice to lie to a Federal Judge. Judges like transparency for some strange reason. We will know tomorrow how the liars faired.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2015/0416/Federal-appeals-court-to-take-up-Obama-s-executive-action-on-immigration-video

[George Rebane]

BillT 553pm - Good catch Mr Tozer, we need to track this. Mind boggling that a non-national security issue re executive action that has all the trappings of unconstitutionality must have its injunction litigated. You'd think the President would want that judgment himself before proceeding with an action that has no time criticality connected to it that serves American interests - now serving the interests of the Democratic Party, that's a different matter.

[Barry Pruett]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/04/16/espn-suspends-reporter-britt-mchenry

Starting to wonder if this behavior is taught to all journalism students at Northwestern? Lol.

[Todd Juvinall]

Congrats on the new Jeep. My son has had a couple and I like those new Italian looks!

Barry, I think that McHenry broad deserves to be fired. She is really a Bee atch. Treating that employee as she did show me that maybe she really is not that smart especially to be a journalist. It does remind me of the corpulent one.

[Jeff Pelline]

Barry's alma mater was in the news last week:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/04/07/miami-university-in-ohio-says-2-students-linked-to-offensive-graffiti-face/
Todd, where did you go to college? I forgot.

[fish]

Posted by: Jeff Pelline | 16 April 2015 at 07:38 PM

I guess Todd figured that fetching coffee was something he could pick up without a masters degree. What's your excuse?

[fish]

In which young Ben Emery practices medicine without a license.....

Weldon,

You are proving Jeff P. correct on his observation as the day comes to an end you stop making sense and should just not comment any longer. What SOJ is fighting for is succession from the state of California.

This comment is a serious comment on my part. Take this coming from a person who was a conservator to a person and am witnessing my father having an issue of sundown syndrome. You might want to have a check up with your doctor for a form of dementia or neurological condition. If you can catch it early you can slow down its progression by treating the symptoms and increasing neurotransmitters or their receptor sites. My dad Parkinson’s first symptoms were little things that we noticed but didn’t think anything of them. RBD sleep disorder was one of them and watching his golf handicap go from a 4-6 to like 12-14 within year for no real reason. Within 15 months he was first diagnosed incorrectly with Alzheimer’s and then within another 12 months was correctly diagnosed with Parkinson’s/ Lewy Body. So for Jeff to notice something like your coherence as the night goes on might be one of those early symptoms.

Fatty thinks everybody who disagrees with him is demented. Apparently a dollop of smug is dispensed with every masters from Northwestern.

[Walt]

The "All American" Jeep isn't so "all American" anymore. I have hand MANY in my life.
Had a 55 CJ5 for a time.. Then made the mistake of buying a 1990 Wrangler.( That's when Chrysler got their hands on it.. What a piece of crap that was.) Then traded the 55 for a Willys Pickup. I sure regret selling my 59 pickup. That was a chick magnet. ( that was only a few years ago.) Now a Grand Cherokee sits in the driveway. Two steps above a piece of crap. Hell.. My Avalanche gets better gas millage.
Nope Jeeps today are not what they used to be.. But one thing has stayed the same... What "JEEP" stands for. Just Empty Every Pocket.
The day will come I find an old 54 delivery panel. ( no rear side windows) The love affair
will hit again.
Someone beat me to my latest want. The old 52 tow truck Kilroy's had for sale. DAMN.. That was a real gem. That was going to be my car show ride. That old girl saved my bacon more than once in it's day.

[Jeff Pelline]

Not only that, but the Jeep is the officials car of the State of California, not the State of Jefferson!
https://youtu.be/qGYR1C6wPo0

[RL Crabb]

Pity the poor Marinites. They may have to breathe the same air as poor people. http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2015/04/15/george-lucas-planning-payback-with-massive-affordable-housing-project-on-his-marin-county-land/

[Jeff Pelline]

Crabb,
Rest assured, you still couldn't afford it! BTW, George was my neighbor in San Anselmo; lived right around the corner. Interviewed him a few times too. Nice guy. I think he got the idea for this scene from the hard-right blogs in western Nevada County:
http://www.starwars.com/video/creature-cantina

[fish]

Posted by: Jeff Pelline | 16 April 2015 at 08:27 PM

Mystery solved......Jabba the Hut.....conjured after being interviewed by idiot neighbor?

[Walt]

Someone is smokin' some other " official Ca." stuff Jeff,, Everyone knows it the under powered traffic jam maker Prius that's the pride of Ca.

[Barry Pruett]

Britt McHenry (Northwestern journalism grad) reprimanded by ESPN for mocking someone for not graduating from college. Jeff (Northwestern jouralism grad) responds by mocking others for not going to college. Classic. #elitist.

[Walt]

WOW.. That school sure knows how to make'm.. Same holyer than thou tude.

[Barry Pruett]

Very much so Walt. It is this elitist attitude of those on the left who demean others based on what they perceive as "education" which creams my corn. Elitists confuse formal education and wisdom. Often times those who are self educated are far more intelligent.

[Jeff Pelline]

Barry,
Here's a better example of mocking: I laughed out loud today when Jim Cramer of Mad Money mocked a caller on the "lightening round" who said he was from the "great region" of northwestern Indiana.

[Todd Juvinall]

Barry I see Waters World interviewing the Jeff Pellines on Cable all the time and they are the stupidest people one can imagine. I get a chuckle out of nuts like Pelline who have to break down and call some dumb plumber to unclog his crapper. What a hoot!

[Todd Juvinall]

It appears things are slow on the Booze blog. That is why he comes here to get pummeled. LOL!

[Todd Juvinall]

Oops, one more thing. I would like Pelline to tell all the readers what he has done for the community in the form of employing others. Other than plunking his silver spoon receipts in the local bank(guessing of course) what has he done for Nevada County?

[Jeff Pelline]

Silver Spoon? Heck it was Barry's mom who claimed his alma mater (Miami University in Oxford, Ohio) was the "Harvard of the Midwest." The locals call it "J-Crew U." LOL

[fish]

Posted by: Jeff Pelline | 16 April 2015 at 09:33 PM

I laughed out loud today when Jim Cramer of Mad Money mocked a caller on the "lightening round" who said he was from the "great region" of northwestern Indiana.

As did I when you typed "lightening" round....which I believe you could benefit from mightily....instead of "lightning" round.

[Jeff Pelline]

fish,
Do you have any friends down in Carmichael to chat with? I'm watching the Giants in extra innings, but it must be awfully late (and lonely) for you.

[fish]

Posted by: Jeff Pelline | 16 April 2015 at 10:51 PM

See we're bonding jeffy....I too am enjoying the G-Men in extras.

[Jeff Pelline]

I really had no desire to come over until I read Barry Pruett's comment from out of left field at 6:44 p.m. What an angry little bird!

[Paul Emery]

George

Not a peep from you on the Repub rollover on TPP.

"WASHINGTON — Key congressional leaders agreed on Thursday on legislation to give President Obama special authority to finish negotiating one of the world’s largest trade accords, opening a rare battle that aligns the president with Republicans against a broad coalition of Democrats."

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/17/business/obama-trade-legislation-fast-track-authority-trans-pacific-partnership.html?_r=0

[George Rebane]

PaulE 1112pm - Begging your pardon. My apologies if I failed to respond to one of your points? If so, which one?

[fish]

You knew it was coming Paul. Your government selling you out to foreign interests.

[Bill Tozer]

Master Degrees are going to the dogs.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/05/johns-hopkins-masters-degree-dog_n_3875440.html

[fish]

There is that legendary Ben Emery sense of humor on display again.

[Barry Pruett]

How did that Giants game end fellas?

Anyway, the point about Britt and Pelline is that in order to be an effective communicator one must be relatable to your listeners. The problem here is that often times when you take someone out of the city there is a failure to relate toyour new neighbors. The holier than though attitude is not well received. Instead of seeing the problem in the mirror, you call it the good old boys club.

When people aak me where I am from, I say Grasa Valley. It is my home ams I am never leaving. Love this place and all the people....even the Northwestern grad and former editor of The Union.

[fish]

How did that Giants game end fellas?

Yuck!

Don't revel in my pain Barry....oh wait you're a Cubs fan.....go ahead then! ;-)

[Barry Pruett]

Ovet a century of losing. I and my ancestors are used to it. Maybe next year...

[fish]

Posted by: Barry Pruett | 17 April 2015 at 07:03 AM

Well there's something to be said for tradition.........

[Jeff Pelline]

Barry @6:54 a.m.,
I am renting a little too much space inside your noggin'. Your comment here about me (on a post about buying a new jeep) was out of the blue and unwarranted. You could probably use some counseling.

[Barry Pruett]

Losing is definitely a Cubs tradition. I have "maybe next year" well over 10,000 times.

[Todd Juvinall]

The Giants are a every other year team now. Oh well.

[Barry W. Pruett]

Better than every other century!

[Gregory]

It's pretty clear who is getting free rent in Pelline's noggin, and that Jeff is lonely now that he's chased everyone off his blog that he could have a good arguement with.

It's probably time for "Annie Fox" to post and give him some solace.

[Todd Juvinall]

When Baumgarner gave up the three run homer I knew we were having a replay of last summer lapse. I still can't understand hw all these players can go cold at the same time.

Regarding Pelline. He has all of us in his noggin rent free since he comes here and does not allow us on his. That is proof of his utter loneliness and rejection by the locals, you know, we Yahoos!

[Joe Koyote]

Kansas is in the news yet again. Apparently people with aid cards can now only withdraw $25 a day from ATMs. Of course no ATM dispenses $5 bills so the actual amount is only $20. The average fee for such a withdrawal is $4.35 and amounts to a 20% "poor tax". So if a person needed $300 to pay rent, they would have to make around 20 withdrawals over 20 days and pay the bank $83 in fees, yet another transfer of wealth from taxpayers to banks only this time poor people are the middle men instead of politicians. Also, welfare recipients in Kansas cannot purchase alcohol or cruises with welfare money but they can use it to purchase a gun. Since governments use taxes and subsidies to encourage or discourage behavior, what is the message here? Perhaps the far sighted Kansas legislators are encouraging poor people to use their welfare money to buy guns to protect themselves from the police rather than by food.

[fish]

Posted by: Joe Koyote | 17 April 2015 at 08:45 AM

Who is paying rent with their EBT cards Joe? That's what Section 8 vouchers are for.

As far as charges involved with withdrawals you would have thought that this would have been addressed when TEAM EVIL held all three branches.....guess not?

And you raise a valid issue.... EBT should only work for essentials...as pro gun as I am I don't think the indigent should be "packing" on my dime.

[fish]

Perhaps the far sighted Kansas legislators are encouraging poor people to use their welfare money to buy guns to protect themselves from the police rather than by food.

Perhaps the far sighted Kansas legislators are encouraging poor people to use their welfare money to buy guns to protect themselves from the police rather than by with food.

Oh wait.....typo....my bad!

[Gregory]

"Perhaps the far sighted Kansas legislators are encouraging poor people to use their welfare money to buy guns to protect themselves from the police rather than by [sic] food."

JoKe, shame on you.

[fish]

Posted by: Gregory | 17 April 2015 at 08:26 AM

....and right on cue! Good call Greg.

Annie Fox says:

April 17, 2015 at 8:16 am

Honestly Weldon has always been nice to me although we don’t see eye to eye. I sincerely hope he is not experiencing this. Ben, it is very nice of you to be so caring and show compassion. Thank you.

I feel slighted because I've only heard of "Gloria Zane" posts second hand and not actually had the privilege to see one in the wild! C'mon jeffy time for a "Sockpuppet Reunion Tour"!

[Todd Juvinall]

I think JoeK is pulling our leg. I have known some "poor" folks here and they had rent paid for, food paid for car paid for and child care paid for. They knew every program where they could get help from the taxpayers. They also had three TV's, a microwave and two frigs. Yep, the poor are sure treated badly. And hey, if you put restraints on how the spend their money (Strippers, Vegas gambling) then you are a meanie in the eyes of the left. What a hoot!

[Gregory]

"Fish", I'd not begrudge the head of a poor household a firearm to protect themselves or their family from the criminals living nearby, and I'll make a wild guess the lawmakers of that state didn't want a welfare recipient to be in a position of having to prove no welfare money was involved in a firearm purchase made because of a justified fear of being a crime victim.

[fish]

Posted by: Gregory | 17 April 2015 at 09:15 AM

In principle neither would I. I'm still a little wobbly about letting recipients purchase them with their welfare money though.

[Joe Koyote]

re: team evil -- aren't they all regardless of so called political affiliation? Both parties are corporate tools. Your propensity to label dems as evil fails to recognize the other side of the same coin. I would think a true libertarian would view both parties as evil, I do and I'm not even a libertarian.

Who is paying rent with their EBT cards Joe? That's what Section 8 vouchers are for. --

That was just an example pointing out what a person would have to go through in order to accumulate more than $20 in cash.

[fish]

Posted by: Joe Koyote | 17 April 2015 at 09:24 AM

Partial credit.

The republicans usually get the TEAM STUPID label which is a worse insult in my estimation. At least a person can muster a degree of grudging respect for evil if it is delivered with panache. Stupid is just stupid!

John Boehner anyone?

[Don Bessee]

My bank atm dispenses in $5 increments.

[Joe Koyote]

Fish -- perhaps a better example of a withdrawal would have been along the lines of "if a welfare recipient needed $300 to buy some crack….."

Which bank is that Don? I have never heard of an ATM with anything but 20's.

[fish]

Posted by: Joe Koyote | 17 April 2015 at 09:46 AM

perhaps a better example of a withdrawal would have been along the lines of "if a welfare recipient needed $300 to buy some crack….."

...from your tone this is an expenditure which you approve?

Which bank is that Don? I have never heard of an ATM with anything but 20's.

I hadn't either since the early 80's when I could get a "fin" or "sawbucks" from my ATM....but there is this.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/18/chase-pnc-atms-1-5-bills-cnn-report_n_2499305.html

[fish]

Joe,

While I'm thinking about it....and within your comfort limits.....what did you do for the State of California?

[Brad C.]

Jon Stewart has a piece on Kansas that puts that welfare state into perspective,

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2015/04/10/jon-stewart-thinks-the-kansas-welfare-bill-is-hypocritical/

[Brad C.]

Maybe Kansas allows guns and ammo purchases (and fishing poles?) to welfare recipients so they will learn to hunt and fish in order to support themselves.

[Brad C.]

Walt, I have a '56 Willys CJ-5 I am going to sell if you want to kick it old school again. It is EMP immune!

[fish]

Posted by: Brad C. | 17 April 2015 at 10:00 AM

Again Brad I'm not sure that it puts anything into perspective. If you don't think that public assistance should be used to buy guns and ammunition that's not an unreasonable argument. But the contrasted position is that why is it bad to spend subsistence money at strip clubs, tattoo parlors and liquor stores if a recipient can use it for guns and ammunition.

How about none of those things should be permitted with public assistance money.

[George Boardman]

While there's no excuse for Britt McHenry's boorish behavior, the outfit that towed her car has a long track record of using any excuse to impound a car. There are many complaints on Yelp about its predatory practices.

On a more serious note, Ruminations is still the best comedy act in town.

[Joe Koyote]

fish-- I was being facetious about the crack. How is it that you think I worked for the state?

[fish]

Posted by: Joe Koyote | 17 April 2015 at 10:16 AM

I thought that you said that you had? If not mea culpa!

[Brad C.]

Fish, Kansas closed the strip club, etc. loopholes (technically) - but not guns and ammo.
However, the whole thing is lame because (I assume) you can just go to some other nearby ATM and withdraw cash and spend it wherever you please.

http://watchdog.org/127789/kansas-welfare-tanf/

Also interesting to me is the bit about Kansas itself being a welfare state.

[RL Crabb]

Walt - I've experienced Brad's Jeep, and will confirm it is a tank. You could probably climb halfdome with it.

[Todd Juvinall]

Maybe we could get some work from the able bodied folks on relief? But apparently the unions won't allow it. Oh well, I guess the gun is better.

GeorgwB, I think a car is towed after it is ticketed by police or sitting in a space after the allowable time. Do you have different info on how the towing company legally can tow? Also, having had a car impounded in Sacramento twenty five years ago, I can say the people were courteous but determined I pay the bill or no car.

[fish]

Posted by: Brad C. | 17 April 2015 at 10:28 AM

Also interesting to me is the bit about Kansas itself being a welfare state.

EBT wasn't supposed to deliver cash if I recall correctly.....that's why the "secondary" market developed. Someone goes in and buys $100 worth of eligible items/groceries and then sells those for sixty cents on the dollar for cash.

And as to the disparity in what Kansas gets versus what it pays well take it up with the congressional seniority and chairmanship structures. It would seem that in a well run government this would be easily remedied.

[Brad C.]

Lol, RL - that "jeep" is my Yota (don't call it a jeep in front of the Toyota guys ;) ..alas, I cannot smog that one.
Not enough legroom for me in the CJ-5 so I found a '64 Scout at auction and am running out of room in my back yard.

[Don Bessee]

Remember gov benefits will buy seeds to plant so they may grow their own food. Along those lines a fishing lure or bullets would also allow families to feed themselves better. Hey what's that smell? OH there it is way back in the thread, he who's name we will not say! ;-)

[George Boardman]

Re Todd's 10:30 a.m.

Here you go http://nypost.com/2015/04/17/espn-was-totally-wrong-to-suspend-britt-mchenry/

As I'm sure you're aware, the New York Post is owned by your favorite media mogul, Rupert Murdoch.

[Gregory]

"How about none of those things should be permitted with public assistance money."

We fund a huge bureaucracy to make sure there are Nannies for all recipients of unearned largess from that state who aren't employed by the state directly. IIRC Friedman, in "Free to Choose", estimated we spent about $60K per annum at the time (1980) on programs 'for the poor'. In 2015 dollars that's about $171k and I expect the problem is even worse... if the poor were actually getting their $171k, being poor would be much more popular.

Stop treating poor adults like children. Most don't deserve it and we really can't afford it. Friedman's answer was a negative income tax scheme as the least objectionable, and I think that remains the best solution.

[Todd Juvinall]

GeorgeB at 12:04 PM

Thanks for the link. It looks to me like Rupert's journalists breaking the story proves he is truly a good publisher.

Regarding the reporters article. Why would you think people who are towed would give anything but a terrible post on YELP? Jeeze, it seems like they might be PO'd?

Also, I think the male who did the article was trying to get a date from the babe. LOL!

[fish]

Annie Fox says:

April 17, 2015 at 11:58 am

Anyone smell some stinky not so hot tuna? He can sure carp at the mouth but has nothing to back it up. At least I respect Weldon as a man.

One would think that improved personal hygiene might help those unpleasant feminine "issues" Annie.

[Bill Tozer]

"Anyone smell my stinky not so hot tuna?" Oh my. I cannot detect the odor from San Diego, but I hear there are quite a few exterminators hot on the trail to rid Nevada City of the mysterious not so pleasant smell whose origins remain unknown. If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Oh goodie, a scavenger hunt! Hey, who swiped my stink locator? Guess I won't be joining the hunt up on Echo Canyon.

[Bill Tozer]

Ok, now I will really stink up the Sandbox:

https://www.facebook.com/SouthernChristianandConservative/photos/pb.438737586179987.-2207520000.1429329162./703686549685088/?type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/SouthernChristianandConservative/photos/pb.438737586179987.-2207520000.1429329162./703686549685088/?type=3&theater

[Russ Steele]

From the Instapundit Glenn Reynolds:

WAIT, MORE PREMATURE INTERNET OUTRAGE? SURELY NOT! Kyle Smith: ESPN was totally wrong to suspend Britt McHenry. “Several reviewers have complained that Advanced Towing brings in legally parked cars — and then, when you complain, simply insults you and holds the car hostage. We don’t even know what was said to McHenry, since the Advanced Towing employee’s remarks have been edited out of the video that went viral. And how do you feel about private companies with which you did not choose to do business making videos of you, then leaking them to the media for the purpose of humiliating you?”

Different perspective. How come the Company Employee's remarks were edited out of the video?

[Gregory]

Scoopy is trumpeting Las Katarinas reopening at an empty restaurant that used to be a local landmark. He first spells the name of that long closed landmark business "Schiedel's", then spells it "Schidel's".

Jeff, it was "Scheidel's", and the food was primarily Schweizerdeutsch, Swiss German. Two demerits, one for never spelling it correctly, one for using two different incorrect spellings. At least be consistent if you can't get it right.

[Jon]

Very nice smackdown in today's Union re: that insane SMART "emergency ordinance" charade from this past week. Not that anyone cares what SMART espouses.

[fish]

Paul Krugman.....the reliable contrary indicator

On Nov. 24, 2013, Paul Krugman of The New York Times gushed:

What would happen if we unveiled a program that looked like Obamacare, in a place that looked like America, but with competent project management that produced a working website? Well, your wish is granted. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you California. … The California authorities have been especially forthcoming with data tracking the progress of enrollment. And the numbers are increasingly encouraging.

http://dailysignal.com/2015/04/20/incompetence-mismanagement-plague-californias-obamacare-insurance-exchange/

[Joe Koyote]

The welfare queens are at it again.. No, not poor people but the low wage payers like Walmart who receive billions of tax dollars in the form of public assistance for their workers.
A new study:http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/the-high-public-cost-of-low-wages/

73% of aid recipients work at least 10 hours a week 27 weeks per year. These working families account for 56% of total state and federal assistance. Coupled with a decrease in employer provided healthcare from 67% in 2003 to 58% in 2013, and you have even more taxpayer subsidy in the emergency room in the form of unpaid bills. The total tab for taxpayer support for working families exceeds $150b a year.

This should be looked at as a direct subsidy to low wage paying corporations because the money they don't pay in wages or benefits goes directly into stockholder profits while, we the taxpayers, make up the difference in living expenses for their employees.

[George Rebane]

JoeK 945am - Unfortunately, without addressing the merits of your argument, the support of Obamacare is reducing the number of hospitals and emergency rooms across the land as local clinics and hospitals are being merged and 'consolidated' by large health maintenance corporations who knew better than Democrats what was in store for America.

Your accounting of what are taxes and subsidies, and their relation to private enterprise is directly out 'Socialism Made Easy'. But in America there is and should be no shame in being a socialist, no matter how far the tipping point is behind us.

[Jon]

Hey Walt, the government of the reddest state in the reddest region of the nation admits that fracking causes earthquakes. Another Lib conspiracy? Spin this one, genius.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/22/us/oklahoma-acknowledges-wastewater-from-oil-and-gas-wells-as-major-cause-of-quakes.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

[Jon]

more precisely, science has proven that the statistically unlikely earthquake cluster in OK are caused by the storage of water from the massive increase in oil and gas fracking over the last decade.

[George Rebane]

Jon 433pm - When you mess with strata near ready to trigger faults, it is possible that the fault will let go and an earthquake will occur. That is not rocket science. Given that, we need to trade off energy production to prevent earthquakes of a certain magnitude. I would not stop fracking when the (Bayesian) probability of a damaging earthquake is small. And then there are the econuts who know better ...

[Don Bessee]

The comic styling's of 'jon' on display again on 18 april. Careful, your falling into old verbal mannerisms again 'jon'. You can keep hiding behind 'jon' but your bovine scatology is way too recognizable to too many. ===== SO lets talk mullahs regional domination plans for 1000 Alex. Friday, death to amika, death to Israel, check. Deny any restrictions in nuclear deal, check. Dispatch armed fleet loaded with weapons to our proxy in yemen, check. Finish spending 11 billion we got from 0 just to come to the table and talk, check. Plan on how we are going to distribute the 50 billion dollar signing bonus, billion in arms to Hezbollah, billion for dissidents in the gulf Arab nations, billion for Iraqi militias, billion in arms to gaza, 5 billion to Assad oh lets just give him 10 billion so he can help attack Israel. Decisions Decisions, that Obama boy is such a nice giving individual. OH, time sure flies when your having fun, got to go to the hangings and flag burnings! Don't worry about the US navy sending the big stick because our friend barack hussien is just a big mouth and has a toothpick & bb's for his big stick. He was so sweet as to get the Saudis to stop the bombing while our fleet is about to make land.

[Walt]

Seems "jon" fails to consider all the man made earthquakes over in Clear lake on a daily basis. Right on a known earthquake zone. Not to mention a shallow magma zone.
That's REALLY playing with fire. You don't see the same quake activity in Nev. with their geothermal power plants.
For a little proof, USGS has a live earthquake map. The proof is in the colored dots.

[Jon]

I don't have to consider anything Walt. I follow science. Case closed in OK.

[Jon]

George, I do appreciate your more thoughtful and honest response to the OK report. Its gotta be pretty clear cut for the government of OK to raise their flags of caution. If you're OK with earthquakes in OK, good for you. Not sure the residents who live over the man-made rumblings would concur.

[Walt]

Oh... So "some" man made quakes are fine and dandy, when others are not.
And those quakes back East have yet to be proven to be associated with FRACKING.
It's still an accusation. Yet The ones two hours from here are proven to be man made.
Yaa,,, so much for your "following of science". Uh,,, "case closed" A'?

[Walt]

Maybe "jon" has the answer to the "mystery booms"
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/01/13/scientists-baffled-by-what-is-causing-mysterious-booms-being-reported-across-the-country/

http://strangesounds.org/mystery-booms-and-rumblings

http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2014/11/mysterious-booms-are-being-reported-across-america-again/

OK "Mr. Science",, FRACKING too?

[Jon]

Walt,
My post was about Oklahoma, notable for their conservative bent, Senator Boren, their astronomical growth of fracking, and earthquakes now PROVEN to have been caused by said industry. Areas of Texas have also seen similar clusters in oil and gas areas. People of OK are now going to weigh the benefits of fracking against the danger of earthquakes caused by the oil and gas industry.

But you can certainly tell us what goes on in Clear Lake to cause earthquake clusters there.

[Todd Juvinall]

Fracking is not causing earthquakes. Jeeze, quakes happen miles down, fracking is close tho t surface. People are simply looking for a scape goat. My bro-in-law is in the middle of fracking in North Dakota and he is a geologist well versed in the earth's crust. Don't fret all you quake enablers.

[George Rebane]

ToddJ 849am - from the physics/geology that I know, the type of small earthquakes that occur in fossil fuel extraction areas are entirely plausible. Can you ask your bro-in-law to point us to research that discounts the emptying of underground oil/gas reservoirs being the cause of those EQs? Thanks.

[Ben Emery]

Todd,
There is long documented history with earthquakes and inserting fluids into the ground. One of the problems when a person strictly relies on partisan sources for their information.

Thanks George for being honest about it.

I didn't want to spend lots of time digging through my files finding the information so I just looked up Rocky Mountain Arsenal and got this paper from 1966.

The Denver Area Earthquakes and the Rocky Mountain Arsenal Disposal Well
http://archives.datapages.com/data/rmag/mg/1966/evans.htm

[Jon]

Todd apparently thinks the government of ultra-red Oklahoma is accepting the science of fracking-related earthquakes to appease that big enviro-lib voting block there. Talk about mindless, iron-blinders. Wouldn't want to say a single thing that could remotely be considered...negative..about the oil and gas industry, right? You give those enviros an inch, they will take a mile, right Todd?

[Jon]

Oh, I forgot about Walt's reference to strangesounds.org. You know, I'll just go out on a limb and make a wild prediction that no one here (except Walter) has ever had the pleasure of monitoring that website.

[Todd Juvinall]

What a hoot! There is no proof that fracking causes earthquakes yet like "global warming" people assume they do because their emotions tell them so. I have seen the "reddest" politicians fall for the eco traps for many years. Just as we see the results in "spotted owls", red legged frogs and in the valley, giant garter snakes. When all else fails the eco's bring out the big cats and the koala bears.

Anyway, my bro in law is a liberal, so "jon" you are truly a smurf. I say "jon", please supply the current scientific finding (peer reviewed) for the earthquakes being caused by fracking.