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20 February 2016


Gary Smith

FBI vs. Apple:
The FBI wants a permanent back door to all encrypted software devices and is using this as a test case. A part that is missing from this story, is this was his work phone. He physically destroyed all of his other devices, so chances are there is nothing on this phone. So a government agency, San Bernardino County, gives an employee a device that it has no way of retrieving the data or seeing what he is doing. What if the employee quit, how would they get the data off it? To me it seems like poor planning to give a worker a device you cannot access. It sure makes his employer look bad, like they needed any more help from the FBI.

George Rebane

GaryS 905am - yes, that is a bit of administrivia common to the incompetent operation of almost all government bureaucracies. But in these short scattershots its importance pales with the implications of Apple's compliance, and the lack of discussion (or even dismissal) of the fairly obvious solution which I offer.

Russ Steele

Apple vs FBI
On my iPhone last night, I saw an article that said the passcode was changed when the phone was under government control, ie an unidentified county employee changed the passcode after the shooting. Could it be the passcode was 1234 and the County IT did not want the world to know how insecure they were, and put in a new passcode and then immediately forgot it, or did the phone have something on it that would have embarrassed the county government. Apple reported that the phone was in government custody when the last change to the passcode was made. I can not find that story in the news this morning, but we had a family discussion about the issue and several of the families most knowledgeable iPhone users, 13 and 14 years of age, reported reading the same story. The 14-year-old suggested George's solution. Have Apple put the data on a thumb drive give it to the FBI. If 14-year-old can figure it out. . .

Michael R. Kesti

Might it be that "the fairly obvious solution" could have a "chain of custody" issue?

I believe that the perpetrators of the 9/11 and subsequent attacks have had more than immediate results in mind. They knew that the American people would be willing to discard freedoms in attempts to gain security and that this would destroy our country from within. This issue with Apple seems to be just one more example of the terrorists' continued success.

Brad C.

Why should your employer have access to text or voice conversations you have, even at work on a work phone? Does every small business employer commonly log and record employee conversations made using landlines - no.
What data do you expect to retrieve from a cell phone: text messages, voicemail messages, selfies with known terrorists? I can see all the voice and text messaging phone numbers everyone on my family cell phone plan has made or received. If an employee was using a company phone on a company plan, I would assume that the employer would have access to all that information as well. If not, the cell phone company could easily provide that info. If you can see who the San Berdu shooter(s) talked to or messaged, you can find out who they are and start spying on them, if need be. I am pretty sure DHS is competent enough to do this.
The only thing I can think of right of the top of my head that might be of some use would be web page history showing the IP addresses of some nefarious dark web sites that terrorists might use. But again, the perp might have had some app on his phone that cleared all his tracks. Don't know if accessed web pages be available on some server somewhere.

George Rebane

MichaelK 1119am - there is no chain of custody issue here if the FBI wants the data for terrorist interdiction purposes. You would have to be a conspiracy theorist on steroids to attribute significant likelihood to Apple doing anything but transmit a faithful copy of the phone's data files to the FBI, especially since it serves their interest in keeping the 'backdoor' out of the feds' hands. And were that the case, then 'the obvious solution' would already have been discussed and dismissed as part of the public record of this issue. The fact that it has not indicates that it is not as obvious as it seems.

It appears that BradC's 1139am that considers some of the coulda/shoulda/wouldas does not address this or any other relevant factor connected with satisfying the FBI's existential requirement to see the data still on the phone in their possession.

Michael R. Kesti

I agree that Apple is likely to deliver the data faithfully. If those data led to any prosecutions, however, the defense need not convince anybody of conspiracy as reasonable doubt is sufficient. As for public records, this is an ongoing investigation and the FBI is therefore not obligated to reveal what it has discussed and dismissed.


"Why should your employer have access to text or voice conversations you have, even at work on a work phone?"-BC 1139

Because they pay for the phone and disclosed the access to you in those forms you signed but didn't read on your first day?


@ Brad..OK,,, your "boss" has access to your "work computer". In some cases every key stroke is logged. What makes a "work phone" any different?

If I happened to a boss to the likes of a "jon",, and found he was using "my" equipment for personal use,on the job or off without prior approval, he/she/it would be a down the road doggy. If I'm paying you to do a job, that means I own your butt while your on the clock.

jon smith

If the FBI has tried 9 passcodes they are pretty screwed. On the 10th incorrect passcode the data is scrubbed. The iPhone has a rock solid set of deadman sensors that considers any attempt to open the phone, input a signal physically through the plug or wirelessly, or remove the simms as the 10th and final passcode attempt. Even freezing the phone is considered an attempt. It is obvious that the FBI screwed the pooch and ran out of passcode attempts. They should have stopped at seven. I can hear some minor subordinate telling his superior as said chief is punching in another passcode, "but, but, but chief . . . . you shouldn't do that!'. Shut up kid.

George Rebane

MichaelK 1224pm - Not to worry Mr Kesti, the San Berdoo ragheads were already prosecuted and the sentence summarily executed on a city roadway. Anything that the FBI may subsequently get from the phone will no doubt be used in a similar 'prosecution' - I understand that due process for Seal Team hits and drone strikes is a bit abbreviated.


Don't know if this is Scattershot worthy but.......


George Rebane

fish 634pm - Timely pick-up Mr fish. Absolutely relevant to the broader election discussion here. I am aghast at what the Bush dynasty must be going through now with Jeb having so ignominiously ended its promise on the national scene. The critical question now is behind which candidate - Cruz or Rubio - will the supporters of the also-rans coalesce.


From what I see, Rubio should be the net to hit the skids. Trump and Cruz are the best bets. Rubio has already slithered to the dark side.

Account Deleted

Gregory at 12:36 - I agree completely. Thank you.

Account Deleted

Next pres? Hillary with an Ace up her - ah, sleeve. Obama will pass the baton to her next year. Sad, but it's my thought of the day. I'll lay my 5 bucks on the line just to make it a bit honest.

Bill Tozer

Oh, Bush's plan to be the kinder gentler Republican looked good last July. Unfortunately, in August some private citizen said some of those illegals are rapists! Poor Jeb, never knew what hit him. Guess he misjudged the mood of the electorate.
I have held this back since Day One, but it is time to spill the beans. I always thought as an executive (not a campaigner) Jeb would be pretty good man to run the government. Probably be a great administrator. But, I am out to demolish the good old boys network, not vote for those who turned their backs on me. Jeb was ok, never lied to me I think, but being a very shallow person, it was time to shake that tree and bust off the branches. Current events made it bad timing. Lights out.
I did like it when Trump said awhile back he could take anyone from the audience, give them 25 million dollars and that person would have higher ratings in the polls than Jeb. Ouch.

Bush's 8-9% will flock to the pretty boy of youth Macro Rubio. Where else are they going to go? To Cruz? To Trump? Nay, the party faithful only have one choice: Rubio. So, give Rubio 5-6 points and Cruz maybe a couple. Looks like Marco just secured 2nd place and Cruz, being as nails, ain't going anywhere. Rubio might even win one here and there. It's a't going to be pretty.
The media is going to have a field day watching those two "also rans" trying to hump the football....as well they should. Did notice Dem turnout was again down from 2008, 20% down in NH and 30% in NV. Prozac time on that side of the aisle. 3 in a row.

Side note: Yesterday Rubio got his feathers ruffled because someone hired two guys in cardboard boxes fashioned to look like robots to tail Rubio everywhere he went, The two fine young men were into the task at hand, flailing their arms and making RoBot noises and movements. Rubio stopped on the sidewalk to talk to reporters and behind him the two robots were doing the Rubot Thang and Marco turned to see what everybody was looking at, turned back frustrated, and Mt Marco almost erupt. He was not amused, but I was. Me bad.. Popcorn time.

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