Scattershots – 18dec16 (updated 21dec16)

George Rebane

Voice from behind the curtain – ‘Pay no attention to the correlation.’

[update]  A reader has pointed out that the above crime map is inaccurate and cites and article in the 16nov16 WaPo (here) that claims to present better data in the map below.  The article's conclusion is italicized.

The violent crime map shows clusters of counties with high rates in South Carolina, Florida, the Memphis area and New Mexico. Several of the clusters are in rural areas where a small number of crimes may generate a relatively high crime rate because there are few people living there. ... The latest data available is from 2014. Reported crime rates for some large cities have gone up over the past two years. ... The National Archive of Criminal Justice Data generates the county-level crime summaries from FBI data that is reported by police agencies.  In rural areas, a county may have one police agency. But large urban counties may have several cities with their own police departments, as well as county-wide agencies. And statewide police agencies may also handle reported crimes. The NACJD adjusts the data for agencies that only report for part of the year and distributes incidents from statewide agencies to local counties by population.

With this conclusion and upon closer examination of the WaPo map, I will let my opening statement stand.

Nevada County Voices has dropped RR from its community website listings.  Since its inception RR has enjoyed coverage by having its recent posts listed and linked in the site’s ‘Right Wing’ column.  The reason for the change is not apparent, especially since RR has always lauded this informative site edited by Dr Anna Haynes.  To be frank, the site and its editor are definitely of the Left persuasion – for example, there is no equivalent listing of ‘Left Wing’ sites.  Apparently all the remainder of the listed sites have no ideological slant or bias that is apparent to Dr Haynes.  Perhaps the removal of RR is part and parcel of the local Left’s perennial call to silence my public voice and involvement as part of their overall crusade to deny opposing opinions and viewpoints a place in the community forum.  In any case it was fun while it lasted, and we will continue featuring Nevada County Voices in the Our Links panel on the right.  [update]  Oops!  My tears flowed too soon; RR has been reinstated in its usual slot.  Now the only nit I have left to pick is my envy of fellow blogger Mr Todd Juvinall (Sierra Dragon's Breath) who enjoys having the last ten of his posts being listed while the rest of us are limited to five max.  Oh well, Anna always did like Todd the best.

RoboVote - a new tool for capturing group preferences and making group decisions.  For years I have designed, purveyed, and used customized decision support systems, especially the kind that help extract useful information from groups of people engaged in some common pursuit.  Recently a team of AI researchers at Harvard released RoboVote (more here and here), a free AI-based, online tool to aid in performing such functions in an optimal manner.  I am recommending its consideration to organizations to which I belong.  Take a look at it and you will want to do the same.

[update]  The WSJ reports "U.S. Factories Are Working Again; Factory Workers, Not So Much.  Donald Trump plans to reignite industrial job growth, but many low-skilled former factory workers are frozen out."  As has been reported here for years, the return of manufacturing to the US does not mean that an equivalent (to previous years) jobs will be returning.  Does no one understand the serious nature of growing systemic unemployment with the acceleration of technology?  Why is this always a surprise and a recent discovery by some maven or other?

[19dec16 update]  Today’s Union informs us that we now have a permanent group of local progressives organized to become the perennial protesters of the Republican controlled (but liberal bureaucratized) federal government.  They call themselves ‘Resistance U.S.’, formed to “promote progressive values and ideas”, and appear visibly uninformed about our Constitution and what happened last month.  For example, as a local embodiment of Moonbeam's Minions, they seek to “Restore Democracy”, a form of government on these shores that never was and wisely was never intended.  We will revisit their demonstrations from time to time as they successfully illustrate what divides us. (more here)

[21dec16 update]

Comments

[fish]

"Nevada County Voices has dropped RR from its community website listings."

Yuck....you're better off......I've been here on and off for a little over three years and I think I've been to one other time.....what a muddled mess!

Looks like the internet equivalent of the inside of a womans purse!

[Paul Emery]

Speaking of the Toddster looks like he has a problem with Trumps assessment of the CIA since Todd was a strong believer of the WMD assessment offered as a justification of the war in Iraq. To quote the TODDER "What a hoot"

Trump has so far dismissed the allegations and mocked the intelligence community. “These are the same people that said Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction,” he tweeted. Trump’s stance has created a rift between himself and several top Republicans who say any possible interference by Russian hackers needs to be fully investigated.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-china-us-drone_us_58554353e4b0390447090ef9

[Paul Emery]

Todd

Now that Todd is born again anti war we can at least agree with Trump that the war in Iraq was a huge mistake based on faulty intelligence and a disastrous turn in our foreign policy. So Todd at least we agree on Trumps view that the war was a total mistake based on lies. See we can agree on something.

Blitzer: “Impeaching him?”
Trump: “Absolutely, for the war, for the war.”
Blitzer: “Because of the conduct of the war.”
Trump: “Well, he lied. He got us into the war with lies. And, I mean, look at the trouble Bill Clinton got into with something that was totally unimportant. And they tried to impeach him, which was nonsense. [N.B. “They” did impeach him.] And yet, Bush got us into this horrible war with lies, by lying, by saying they had weapons of mass destruction, by saying all sorts of things that turned out not to be true.”

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/439636/donald-trump-george-w-bush-and-lies

[Don Bessee]

Its nice to PE is back on his Bushmania track. ;-)

[Paul Emery]

Not about Bush Don it's all about Trump and something I agree with him about. that's a good thing don't you think. Something we have in common. I'm sure you're anti war as well. No electing that war monger Clinton this time around.

[George Rebane]

PaulE 1155am - Do you consider believing a (generally accredited source) at some time in the past, to be inconsistent with not believing the source after new information (say, discrediting the source) has been received in the interval? Or are you one of those who holds that once you believe a source, you must always believe the source else you are irrational or worse, a hypocrite?

[Paul Emery]

I mean it's amazing that the Republicans elected someone to the Presiedncy that cdalled the previous Republican President an outright liar as well as taking Strong opposition to such strong Republican causes as TPP and NAFTA. this was a true revolution within the Republican party and I commend them for it. Much more adventuresome than the Dems which is the main reason they lost.

I'm still a Johnson guy but he was remarkably wimpish this time.

[Paul Emery]

That's "called the previous Republican ..."

[Gregory]

Wasn't Trump a Democrat in 2008? The Clintons even went to his last wedding and he was donating money to the Clinton cause.

Toddster, Pubbies. Paul, do you miss your elementary school playground?

At least you're off your "majority vote" monomania.

Let's see where we are:
1) no one thinks there's a chance Trump will lose any significant number of Electors, and Pelosi's daughter has been formally denied the intelligence briefing focused on the dastardly Russians that she wanted before casting her Electoral vote tomorrow.

2) No specific action of the Russkies has been linked to any specific information.
3) No wikileak has been identified as false.
4) No allegation of ballot or counting tampering by any agent, Russian or other, has been identified.
5) Multiple people with good reputations have been adamant the WikiLeaks were from a leak withing US intelligence, not the Russians.

Much sound and fury signifying nothing. Paul, are you ready to accept Trump as the lawful president-elect?

[Don Bessee]

Who cares if PE, Huma, Weiner, Brazil, Podesta accept the result that will come formally tomorrow. It we be done and over, live with it, President Trump is the reality you will have no choice but to live with. ;-)

[Todd Juvinall]

Pul Emery, you really are a can short of a six-pack. Your posts here naming me are your own fabrication. I could care less that Trump has his position on WMD's. I am not a snge issue person like you are with your Bush Derangement Syndrome or marijuana. I bet you think FDR knew the Japs were gonna attack Pearl Harbor too. So I have asked you before to not put things on paper I have not said. You now have TDS or Trump Derangement Syndrome. A good dose of balls will clear that up.

[Todd Juvinall]

Careful with those maps GeorgeR. The left will have one that shows more welfare cases in red state than blue states and they will make some wild ass assumptions. LOL!

[Todd Juvinall]

Oh and I never asked Haynes to put me on her site. She just did it. And I guess she likes that I am a flamethrower as she puts more of my posts there. I see your nemesis Pelline is failing to read this article correctly as well. The man is really qquite odd.

[Paul Emery]

Sorry Todd I was just looking for something we might have in common. Not even agreeing with Trump policies will work. I think you have EDS. Emery Derangement Syndrome.

Sure Gregory, Trump is the guy. I'm just not happy with it as you appear to be. His policies have no connection with any aspect of Libertarian thought so why are you so gooey about him?

[Todd Juvinall]

Paul Emery, no I am not concerned about a syndrome. But you sure are out there. Find that "grassy knoll" guy yet. You are a single issue lover and I am much more universal. Big difference in the real worls.

[Walt]

Maybe Paul can explain why LIBS tolerate so much crime. (the maps say it all.)

[stevenfrisch]

Yeah, says it all if you don;t believe in FACTS.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/11/16/no-the-viral-image-of-2016-election-results-and-2013-crime-rates-is-not-real/?utm_term=.95868ef41e29

[Don Bessee]

The Sunday night mystery, will the Dark Lord of Liberal Lament Land berate Frisch for 'don;t' ? ;-)

[George Rebane]

stevenfrisch 450pm - If you can give me an updated map of relative crime rates across the country produced by some federal law enforcement agency, I'll gladly revise the above post with that map. And thanks in advance. (In this case, please don't limit yourself to WaPo's version.)

[Bill Tozer]

That didn't take long. Pull out the Che tee shirts, things are back to normal.

https://www.rt.com/usa/370698-calexit-california-embassy-moscow/

[Walt]

Bill. That just gives the State of Jefferson idea added credibility. " See? These are the lunatics we have been warning you about. And you wondered why?"

[Bill Tozer]

Why waste time wondering what Trump might do. He is not President nor has his State Department advised him or gave Trump counsel on Russia. Paul always gets wound up like a kid on Christmas Eve waiting for Santa. We just don't know how Trump will handle the Obama/Clinton cluster in the Middle East. Backing the Muslim Brotherhood to do regime change in Egypt, Libya, and Syria has made a mess of things. A bloodbath, a needless bloodbath. For what? Assad won, Russia is now stronger than ever as a direct result of Obama/Clinton polices, and Putin is stronger and more popular than ever at home in Mother Russia. Geeze.

Heck, we got Libya to play nice and behave until Obama stepped in and messed up a good thing. In Syria, even the British Parliament blocked Great Britain from going along that horrible disaster. Now the rebels we backed in Syria are burning the evacuation buses that Assad provided for safe exit and passage (per the cease fire) of both civilians and rebel fighters. The side we backed torched the buses! We backed Sunnis and ISIS is Sunni. What a disaster.

Wait and see. Yep, I give Trump a blank check until he is sworn in as President and sitting behind his desk in the Tower. I hope he stays out of the Swamp known as Washington DC.

Meanwhile, Obama and Kerry-Heinz are in charge.

https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/979072252226812/?type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/979115615555809/?type=3&theater

[Bill Tozer]

Well, Paul can rest easier now.

https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/979635545503816/?type=3&theater

[Bill Tozer]

Thank goodness for Fact Checker.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2016/12/17/snopes-will-fact-checking-facebook-employs-leftists-almost-exclusively-read-httpdailycaller-com20161216snopes-facebooks-new-fact-checker-employs-leftists-almost-exclusiv/

Ok, how about this map.

https://www.facebook.com/RowdyConservatives/photos/a.217983685002343.55586.217926015008110/978681812265856/?type=3&theater

Nightly night.

[stevenfrisch]

Posted by: George Rebane | 18 December 2016 at 06:34 PM

Funny George, that map is embedded in the link to the WP story I posted....what is wrong with the WP version, it is based on the National Archive of Criminal Justice data at the US DOJ using data reported by the FBI. It's kind of t he gold standard of sources.

[George Rebane]

stevenfrisch 807pm - Posted; thanks Steve.

[Account Deleted]

SF at 8:14 - Data from the FBI? Gold standard. But I thought the FBI was not to be trusted. Or was that the CIA. Gettin' kinda' hard to keep up with all the talk from the left about who's in and who's out. Be nice if maybe the left could do a huddle and come up with a straight story about who we're supposed to believe.
Anyway, everyone knows that Chicago is crime free. And all those other big cities. It's those podunk little towns where all the crime is. Yessir. Ol' Andy from Mayberry could barely contain the mayhem that went on.
All the rioting and looting and murders and what all.
Good to see Steven set us straight about how it's Lodi and Goshen that is causin' all the fuss and bother in this country. So if you hear about how the fire depts in some big city won't even go into certain neighborhoods because of violence, just tell 'em that slick Mr Frisch is callin' their bluff. He says it's all baloney.

[Gregory]

Paul, of the two candidates on the ballot with a chance of winning, Trump is the only one who would nominate Justices closer to Scalia than Ginsberg. Two or three of those would cripple the court for 30 years.

It isn't "gooey" to prefer a Supreme Court that pays attention to the text of the Constitution... why are you so "gooey" about Hillary?

Right now, what we've been seeing is a partisan witch hunt trying to invalidate the election. I get it, Democrats want a do-over. It isn't constitutional and it isn't going to happen unless 37 faithless GOP electors take the radical Democratic Party line.

Good luck with that.

Here's a libertarian line for you:

Now, we're shifting into our Russia Panic phase. The CIA claims that the Russians attempted to interfere in the election to assist Trump. This seems wholly plausible, considering Trump's favorable view of Russia President Vladimir Putin, and it should be fully investigated. There's still debate among U.S. intelligence services about the Russian hacks, but that hasn't stopped some Democrats from questioning the patriotism of those who refuse to accept the hysterical version of events. Well, unless the Russians transformed Hillary Clinton into an unlikable, ideologically malleable, corrupt, inveterate fabricator over the past 30 years, the claims that the Russians stole an election should, like all other panics this season, be received with a giant dose of skepticism.

Of course, there will always be overarching theories about why Republicans win elections—like assuming half the country is racist. The left is so enveloped by its identity politics that it may not understand that the other half of the country is sick of it. While I'm no fan of Trump, Democrats have been demanding that I panic over every Cabinet pick, every statement and every event. It's not normal.

http://reason.com/archives/2016/12/16/the-5-stages-of-losing-an-election-to-do

[stevenfrisch]

Posted by: Scott Obermuller | 18 December 2016 at 09:56 PM

I don't think that anyone is claiming the crime statistics provided by the FBI and local law enforcement and tested and compiled by the National Archive of Criminal Justice have been cooked---the data is from the FBI but the statistical analysis and mapping is from the DOJ.

The point I was making Scott is that there is very little correlation between a 2013 'crime map' [see de-bunk below] and a 2016 electoral map, particularly when one digs down at the local level, and no causation. In our own back yards we can see that in California many high crime areas voted for Trump and the same is true across much of rural America.

The use of those two maps was intended to imply high crime areas and people voted Democratic and low crime ones Republican, but when one looks at the data that is simply not true.

It is an intentional false narrative.

I could do the same thing the map George posted did with a map of "makers and takers" by the way--urban areas that voted Democratic contribute more in taxes than they receive in services, rural areas that voted Republican receive more-- the Democrats are the makers and the Republicans are the takers. Does that mean Republicans are actually secretly the socialist government 'welfare queens'?

Or I could do that map for opioid use and drug addiction in America, and guess what--the areas with the lowest per capita rates of addiction are urban and Democratic and the highest rates of addition are rural and Republican--does that mean that Republicans are drug addled middle aged white men with erectile dysfunction and periodic constipation who drive white pick up trucks?

There is no relation and I know it.
------------------------------------------------------

By the way, even the meme map that George posted is inaccurate--the second map is not a '2013 crime map', it is an altered copy of the 2012 electoral map RELABELED as the "2013 crime" map--thus the entire premise of the comparison is fake.

[Account Deleted]

Steven - you can cook the numbers any way you like. Everyone knows the areas controlled by Dems are far more likely to be areas that most any one in the world trying to raise a family would rather not live in. Of course there are exceptions, (left wing white lunatics that think they deserve to be beaten by criminals) but the rule is pretty clear. The real estate values in different neighborhoods bear this out. Again, there are exceptions such as we see along the Cali coast. But nation wide, it's simply safer and more peaceful to live in a Red area. I note that a lot of the rural high crime areas of your WaPo map coincide with areas of high amounts of Indian reservations. Drug addiction rates can be high in areas of high unemployment no matter rural or urban.
The bald fact of the matter is that the dems have had decades (and billions of fed dollars) to work their magic on society and it's a complete failure as far as lifting the average poor person out of poverty. But it's worked a treat for the Dem power structure. And that's all the Dems care about. Power.

[stevenfrisch]

My point Scott is that the frigging 'map' is a fraud. You may be happy to use or countenance fraud to support your point, but having the strong mid-western values I have, I would prefer facts.

[L]

Then 'splain me why the governor of VA was in such a hurry to restore the civil rights (voting) of resident felons? L

[stevenfrisch]

Posted by: L | 19 December 2016 at 07:44 AM

Besides that point that this comment has nothing to do with the original point of my response: that THE MAP IS A FRAUD...I will answer it.

There are currently 10 states that may permanently eliminate voting rights as a consequence of a felony conviction. There are 38 states that restore those rights after some combination of serving the term or incarceration, completing parole or completing a period of probation. They are 2 states that do not restrict voting rights for felons at all--Maine and Vermont.

Virginia Governor Terry McAuliffe signed an order moving Virginia from the column that permanently restricts voting rights to the column of 20 states that restore voting rights for felons who have completed their term of incarceration, parole and probation. That order is being challenged in court.

The states that allow the restoration of voting rights after incarceration include: West Virginia, Wisconsin, North & South Dakota, North & South Carolina, Utah, Texas, Pennsylvania, Oklahoma, Ohio, Nebraska, Missouri, Montana, Michigan, Louisiana, Kansas, Indiana, Idaho, Georgia, Idaho, Arkansas and Alaska...all states that voted for Donald J. Trump.

[fish]

Posted by: stevenfrisch | 19 December 2016 at 08:51 AM

....THE MAP IS A FRAUD...I will answer it.

Wow....looks like somebody dumped a big ol bucket of Wikipedia on L's head! No real need to answer L's question.....there's no mystery as to why Terry extended voting rights to felons this year.

[George Rebane]

It's hard to countenance that there still are educated people who deny that population centers with the highest incidents of crime (especially of the violent kind) are and have been under Democrat control for decades. In what smaller towns in middle America is it unsafe to walk the streets at night? Now ask that same question of entire sections of Dem controlled large urban areas.

[Todd Juvinall]

I thought our Jerry Brown was trying to allow incarcerated felons the vote.

[Todd Juvinall]

I guess I am a bit confused about the maps. If you overlay one over the other aren't teh results pretty much the same. And I recall Nevada City was judged as a violent city with two murders per capita, in the whole country!

[Account Deleted]

from Frisch, who just has to add a fact-free insult to his posts: "You may be happy to use or countenance fraud to support your point."
Note that Frisch can not demonstrate in any way that I 'use or countenance fraud' so he attempts a crude and dishonest implication.
"By the way, even the meme map that George posted is inaccurate--the second map is not a '2013 crime map', it is an altered copy of the 2012 electoral map RELABELED as the "2013 crime" map--thus the entire premise of the comparison is fake."
And the map that Frisch shows is an 'altered' and re-labeled map of the US. It's just one that he prefers. You can play with statistics to make any map you please. Reported crimes, actual crimes, various levels of violence, what definition you use for a certain level of violence, rates of violence vs outright numbers, what years were included in the statistics gathering, etc.
But Steve gets a pat on the head and a participation star on his forehead.
Oh - about the issue concerning the Virginia gov's orders. Frisch is leaving out a few salient points. By accident, I'm sure. The citizens were not allowed to vote on this touchy subject. It involved a mere 200K felons. The orders were just in time for the election and all of the individuals involved received ballots with return pre-addressed envelopes.
He may as well have ordered the ballots to be pre-marked straight party ticket while he was at it.
Of course it was an open and bald power play to boost the Dems chances on election day. If the majority of those felons were likely to have voted R, Terry never even would have considered the action.
But I'm sure that Frisch just forgot all of this.

[Todd Juvinall]

Yes ScottO, he just forgot. LOL!

[Paul Emery]

Todd

Grassy knoll? What an original thought. Deep thinking Todd.

[Gregory]

The charge of fraud reminds me of the overall "fact check" mentality that is not a good thing.

A fraud, like other lies, requires the intent to deceive. While that map *may* be in error and may have been fraudulently represented by someone, it is also possible that *someone*, with a particular notion of crime they wanted represented, came up with that map. It could also be they were fiddling with what notion in order to get a map that looked a lot like the vote results... but that wouldn't fit "fraud".

Similarly, some "journalist" (Candy Crawley 4 years ago comes to mind) "fact checking" a politician may well be even more wrong than the politician they're playing gotcha with, or working with a set of assumptions that lead to a different answer.

In short, we have many fewer lies and frauds than are charged.

In the news, I'm sure we are all happy there is at least one Elector voting their conscience: NPR reports a Clinton Elector in Maine has cast a vote for Bernie.

[Todd Juvinall]

Paul Emery | 19 December 2016 at 10:32 AM

Did you forget to take your meds today?

[Paul emery]

How original Todd. One time you were somewhat entertaining and clever. You're just a shell of your former self.

[Todd Juvinall]

No Paul Emery. I am smart and erudite and well liked. You, not so much. I do feel sorry for your slip though. And as usual, you did not take your meds.

[Todd Juvinall]

I see the Frisch and Pelline favorite people just murdered the Russian Ambassador and many Christmas goers in Germany. Ah, the religion of peace on displat again. Maybe the local lovelies can place a wreath?

[Tom Odachi]

Todd,
Your use of the racial epithet, "Jap" (18 Dec 2016 @ 1:53 PM)
"I bet you think FDR knew the Japs were gonna attack Pearl Harbor too.", as well as in your blog describing drivers in "Jap cars", needs to be challenged by somebody.

The term "Jap" is a racial slur that should offend readers in our community. As a 4th generation American of Japanese ancestry, I find your use of the word shocking to say the least. I wouldn't expect that language from a former County Supervisor.

[Bill Tozer]

@12:10 pm

Wonder what the motive was? I bet they Left as good friends.

[Todd Juvinall]

Tom Odachi, do you deny the term Jap is contained in the name "Japanese"? My dad was at Okinawa and was attacked everyday by Jap kamikaze fighters. He used the term for a decriptive reason, short for Japanese. Now if I had said "nip" or "slant" I would be justly chastised. By I am not a racist so take your PC crap elsewhere.

[Gregory]

Tom Odachi, while I sympathize, when referring to the members of the Emperor's government and the Japanese military who performed a sneak attack on Pearl Harbor, "Jap" is probably appropriate.

I've had friends who were guests of the USA at Manzanar during WWII, but they weren't Japanese. They were born here.

[Gregory]

Todd, my dad spent a year of hia service in WWII in an Army hospital suffering from Dengue Fever picked up in the Pacific Islands, and suffered a bout every few years for the rest of his life. I can't remember him ever using "Jap" outside of discussions of the war years.

[Todd Juvinall]

Absolutely Gregory. A American of Japanese ancestry is to me a American. I suggest he go see "Hacksaw Ridge" and get back to us.

[Bill Tozer]

I thought JAP stood for Jewish American Princess. White is short for Caucasian, what is short for someone of Japanese heritage? J? Yeah, I got reprimanded once for saying Pollock. Live and learn. The Japs did bomb Pearl Harbor, or was it the Japanese Imperial Navy? Gosh, everything is getting longer and longer to say. Like, first there was the Gay and Lesbian Center. Then they added bi-sexual, ok, LBG. Then they added a T. Next comes the Q. Some told me Q does not stand for Queen, as in cross dresser.

I now think that Q stands for question, as in I ain't a boy or a girl or a cyborg or....what the hell am I? That is the Q for question. In all fairness, I have no idea and can't that answer the Q. Maybe one of those robots lonely men are attracted to,

No saying Jap. Oh, you can't say ghetto anymore either. It's racist or White Priviledge or something. So much to learn, so little time.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ-r0bilzhU

[Todd Juvinall]

Or "posse"! Blacks say it is racist! What a hoot! These PC loons are too much. Pretty soon we will all look the same and speak the same. If Odachi wants backup for his feelings of outrage, go to Canada, They arrest you for saying climate change (man made)is not real is a hate crime.Ask MArk Steyn. Anyway, Trump has blown these PC labels all to hell and now Americans can truly enjoy free speech again. And BillT, Q is, well, you know, queer. LOL!

[Paul Emery]

Todd writes:

"I am smart and erudite and well liked. You, not so much."

Gosh and golly Todd I seem to be pretty well liked in our community having won the Bill Lambert award for public service this year and being featured in the Constitution day parade. When was the last time you were honored in such a manner?

[stevenfrisch]

Here is the deal Scott, when one tolerates untruth, fails to reject a lie and fraud when it is advanced [which George's map is] and then pointed out, they are tolerating it, they are countenancing it.

That is what countenance means.

And oh yeah, using "Jap" is clearly a slur....and people who push the envelope of racist slurs just to get a little charge in their pants ..well we know what they are.

[Todd Juvinall]

{aul Emery, well congrats. I was elected four times here that might be a clue. How about you? A couple of potheads pick people to honor in NC is OK I guess.

[Gregory]

Frisch, your testimony is not enough to establish an "untruth".

[Todd Juvinall]

Frisch Jap is short for Japanese. You are just too PC. You have been tossed aside this election. What a hoot!

[Gregory]

Paul, the Bill Lambert award is mostly a sign you are liked by a particular small circle of friends.

[Walt]

The day will come, PC will be outlawed. That day will come when the PC crowd gets bit in the ass by their own PC.

[Paul Emery]

Todd

I was picked by the Marching Presidents Committee.

Todd Elected four times here? I recall a couple of Supes terms then a long losing streak before you gave it up. What were the other two?

[Bill Tozer]

1:01 pm:

Ok, Mr. Odachi and Mr. Frisch are confident Jap is a slur, but not clearly a racial slur to me.. To me it was just short for Japanese. Heck, I once did a history report in grammar school based on the dusty hardbound book " The Japs Are Coming". Yes, it was a WW2 era book found in the school library.

Gregory makes a good point. Jap is taken in the context of the enemy we fought in WW2 in the Pacific Theater. My dad was a submariner on the sub that snuck through the nets in Tokyo Harbor and sent a message. That sub later went back out to sea and is still on patrol. My dad was the only survivor of the orginal crew.

Be that as it may, I will not belabor the point. If Jap is "CLEARLY a slur" whether it is a racist slur or not or intented to be a slur or not, that is not the real issue. The real issue is that the word Jap is taken as a slur. I will consider that is how the word Jap is taken by the listener in today's world. Besides, when you think about it, one says he/she/it goes out to have Japanese food....you don't say you are going out to eat Jap food. Makes sense now that I think about it.

I do know how touchy people can get. Never, never, never call an Aussie a Brit. Those are fighting words. And never never call a Japanese person Chinese. That really is considered an insult or being totally ignorant at a minimum, believe you me.
Sorry for the digression and veering off topic. I have been brought up to speed, but I still call the remote control device my "clicker", no matter how hard the kids tried to break me of that bad habit. Heck, my sister and bro-in-law call their I-Pads "machines", but they do that just to see their adult children roll their eyes for the 1,000th time. Clicker works for me.

[Paul Emery]

Todd writes:

"A couple of potheads pick people to honor in NC is OK I guess."

Here are the previous winners you've managed to insult . Good going.

Past Lambert Award recipients are retired city manager Beryl P. Robinson Jr., former mayor and city clerk Cathy Wilcox-Barnes, longtime parade organizers George and Pat Harper, city councilman and former mayor Pat Dyer, the late real estate broker Jim Mackey, local writer Dave Carter, Chamber of Commerce executive manager Cathy Whittlesey, former mayor Steve Cottrell, businessman Bob Buhlis, retired Nevada County general services director Dennis Cassella, John Christensen, a leader of community efforts to establish the Nevada County Narrow Gauge Railroad Museum; cartoonist R.L. “Crabman” Crabb, business owners Lee and Susan Thurston, Nevada City public works director Verne Taylor, the late historian Edwin Tyson, the late folksinger/activist U Utah Phillips, city engineer Bill Falconi, Marching Presidents organizer Patti Foster, retired school administrator Karen Chizek, musician Mikail Graham, retired county librarian Madelyn Helling, local builder Gary Tintle, former mayors Paul Matson and Reinette Senum, and Nevada City Film Festival Director Jesse Locks. Marching Presidents founder David Parker was honored with the group’s 20th anniversary award.

[Paul Emery]

Gregory

You're a Marching President and part of the group that voted for me. Why do you hang out with such shady characters?

[Walt]

To our Libs in panic mode. YES,, Trump won despite the hissy fits your friends have thrown The special suicide hotline is now plugged, and the next available slot will not be until FEB 16TH. Sorry for the inconvenience. BTW.. Marry Christmas. I know, I know. Some of you are now butt-hurt because I just said that..(Tough)

[Don Bessee]

PE 236- You are hanging out here with the deplorables so where do you get off chastising Gregory?

I wonder if Frisch let a 2nd black guy talk to him yet?

PE- Your gangs faithless electors efforts failed today and ended up having more faithless madam liar liar pantsuits on fire electors than President Trump. All that is left is for grandpa joe to make the Senate announcement of todays vote next month! ;-)

[Walt]

Mr. Bill!! Got any of that "Dr. D.J. Trump's salve" left? Now would be a good time to pass it out, and just in time for the Holidays.

[Paul Emery]

Not my gang Don. I voted for Johnson. Enjoy your win. Trump will hang on your neck like a porkchop chased by a pack of dogs when it comes time to pay the fiddler. Enjoy yourself till then.

[fish]

I imagine the democrat powers that be are probably pretty happy to be done with the Clinton family. Truly a case of....."not our kind dear"!

BREAKING NEWS: Donald Trump wins Electoral College - as attempts to cause rebellion turn to farce with DEMOCRATS deserting Hillary

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4048394/The-Latest-Electoral-College-meets-formally-elect-Trump.html

[Don Bessee]

While you may have voted for Johnson you are still team lefty PE. So why is it ok for you to hang out when its not for Gregory? ;-)

[fish]

Not my gang Don. I voted for Johnson.

Really looking forward to seeing you square the circle of voting for a libertarian presidential candidate and yet still calling for socialized medicine.

[Paul Emery]

Fish

Libertarians have a wide variety of views on what is considered government services.

[Don Bessee]

PE- knock, knock. Why is Gregory hanging around different than your posting? Crickets to follow. ;-)

[fish]

Posted by: Paul Emery | 19 December 2016 at 03:31 PM

Having many friends and acquaintances of this bent I can tell you that not a one considers government administrated health care even slightly libertarian.

You keep chasing that rainbow though......

[Paul Emery]

I am part of a faction of Libertarians that call themselves Green Libertarians. I'll explain it to you sometime. Pretty simple.

[Paul Emery]

Can you rewrite that Bessee? Don't have a clue what you're talking about.

[fish]

Posted by: Paul Emery | 19 December 2016 at 04:04 PM

Well I'm all ears.

[Paul Emery]

All based on the simple observation that a bear doesn't shit in his own back yard. Take it from there

[Walt]

OH... I see Paul is making up a new political stripe. Just like he does with religions from time to time. This has been a good time for Paul for nude antics down at the river.

[Paul Emery]

Too cold Walt even for us Druid Deists.

[fish]

Posted by: Paul Emery | 19 December 2016 at 04:14 PM

Was that your explanation of "Green Libertarianism"?

[Don Bessee]

PE 405- Just giving you a taste of your own medicine. ;-)

[fish]

Yeah....remember last week when the lefty MSM were losing their collective minds over Trumps preference for not receiving a daily briefing........

Obama Hits The Golf Course After Learning About Turkey, Berlin Attacks

Yeah....I don't expect to see much MSM attention paid to this either.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-19/obama-hits-golf-course-after-learning-about-turkey-berlin-attacks

[Paul Emery]

Pretty much Fish

To put it simple most problems we face as a society should be solved culturally. We should only need government intervention when that fails. For example a bear does not need environmental laws because he doesn't shit in his own backyard. Pretty simple.

[fish]

Posted by: Paul Emery | 19 December 2016 at 04:31 PM

....and this is a reasonable argument for compulsive government run medicine?

[Walt]

Good one Paul,, Thanks for showing us you know jack shit about bears. Bears LIVE in the woods... Bears CRAP in the woods. I doubt those bears use those Forest service, taxpayer funded shithouses that dot the forests. (trail heads at least)

[Paul Emery]

Shouldn't need to be run by the government but culturally and spiritually we are not social Darwinists so we require as part of out humanitarian instincts that people not die in the streets of disease or rot from infections so we as a culture take care of people. When free enterprise fails to do that due to greed or whatever we must step in and come up with a different solution. There is no country in the civilized world that does not have some form of national health care. What that system is is up for grabs but I prefer single payer universal insurance.

[Bill Tozer]

Walt @ 4:17

Oh boy. I have seen what Paul pulls out of the river. Hey, if that is his bag, so be it. I have heard of the Grandmother syndrome once before, and it ain't pretty. I think is some sick creepy stuff myself, put it's always good get a second opinion.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iZnQPLJi2t4

[Walt]

Paul must have found some MJ on the street. EVERY "society" is run by some form of gov.
Right down the the jungle tribes.( One of the largest libraries of National Geographic in private ownership says so.) Next try is outer space for Paul.

[Bill Tozer]

Fish @ 3:20 pm-----the electoral college vote.

Well, I did notice that Hillary lost votes today. Pity.

But, here is the best part. The wingnut bedwetters got themselves all worked up and actually believing they could switch Trump votes. Yes we can, yes we can! There was that guy saying people were calling him from all over and he was offering free legal advice and counsel how to switch....and he had 20 Electors ready to jump, maybe 30. That got the left wing banana brains all excitied and hopeful and their hopes soaring again. Up to the stratosphere.
I heard about 3 days ago that somebody called the guy and he said he knows nothing about it, heard nothing about it, and it's all a bogus story.

Well, I kept quiet because I wanted to get some of our dear local NeverTrumpsters having that Hope Burns Eternal thang soaring up, up, and away. Then watch them get ground back into the dust one more time. , ROFLMFUEO. Fake News strikes again.

I feel good, real good, and hopeful. Hey Michelle, somebody took your hope and gave it to a basket of deplorables. I know how crushed y'all are about that Hope and Changy thing.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_pq3udWqoPw

[Gregory]

Paul, the Marching Presidents riff-raff don't vote on the Bill Lambert award, nor do they even get told who is being considered. It's just a small inner circle with Sparky at the center.

A number of the past recipients deserve robust insults with the late Col. Lambert spinning in his grave, present company excluded.

[Gregory]

Regarding Paul's "green" wing of the Libertarian Party, it's generally been referred to as the Let's Party Wing of the LP. Relegalization of pot is a popular (pfffffftht) plank (ahhhhhhhh) for many.

"Times of dope gets you through times of no money better than money gets you through times of no dope."-Freewheeling Franklin Freak, circa 1970

[Walt]

Can someone tell me how long weed lasts in storage? I might need a reminder of why I stopped smoking it.(it's been there a LONG time.)

[Bill Tozer]

Apparently, Gary Johnson has a big tent. Well, a vote is a vote. I though Paul was more of a Jill Stein voter. Big government and a greenie. She did say she was Bernie long before Bernie. She also said Hillary was corrupt and should be convicted for what she done, which put Paul off. Bernie, on the other hand, said he was tired of hearing about those gosh darn it e-mails....until the e-mails talked about him.

Decisions, decisions. Both Bernie and Jill loved Castro, but Bernie honeymooned in the USSR and outside the Paris Peace Talks. burning the flag or something. But, then again, Paul likes that balanced budget stuff...at least he spouts the evils of running up the debt.. Oh, each man must decide within his own heart and vote for the one that best represents his world view and priorities.

Speaking of Jill, has anybody seen Brother Ben lately? That is one mean green kick ass machine.

https://www.facebook.com/lastamericapatriots/photos/a.235087906641439.1073741826.235086849974878/765046386978919/?type=3&theater

Imagine leaving office with a net worth of 700k and then making 179 million.
https://www.facebook.com/PatriotPost/photos/a.82108390913.80726.51560645913/10154280985575914/?type=3&theater

[Account Deleted]

SteveFrisch at 1:01 - Nobody asked you what countenance means. Nice try. I could name all sorts of evil things you didn't denounce in the last couple of days, but I'm not going to try to say that you countenance them.
The 'fact' that the map is a fraud is clear only to you. I really don't have enough info as to who made it or what their methodology was to make the decision that it is a fraud. If you want to continue your line of reasoning that Mayberry is more dangerous than Chicago, please make your case. Even the left in Chicago are bemoaning the high rates and total amounts of violence there. As it is in most all large metro areas controlled by the Dems.

[Don Bessee]

So Walt, you have a weed section in your wine cellar? ;-)

[Walt]

Uh,,,,, Right next to the meat locker. Who's up for THChicken?? That's one I have yet to try. That "well cured" weed might not pass the bong test,, but stoned chicken??
All the neighbors might catch a contact buzz.

[ScenesFromTheApocalypse]

https://twitter.com/WhiteHouse/status/810940991377211393/

[Walt]

LIBS can NEVER be trusted, even when they make promises. I have proof.
http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/19/we-found-15-celebs-who-threatened-to-leave-after-trumps-win-guess-where-they-are/