Scattershots – 1nov17 (updated 4nov17)

George Rebane

Single-payer sounds of silence.  Our lamestream has been forever silent on the blatant shortcomings and fake news about other countries’ SP healthcare systems, especially their posterchild, the UK’s National Health Service.  None of the laments published by the British press about NHS foibles and failures make it to this side of the pond, nor into the noggins of our Bernistas.  The recent clarion warnings appearing in newspapers like the Daily Telegraph are no exception.  We now learn that more and more of NHS death committees (unelected bureaucrats whose word on regional healthcare practices are final) have decided to “ban patients from surgery indefinitely”, thereby passing virtual death sentences for people who smoke or have BMIs considered too high.  In the UK (pop 65M) 3.8M are now waiting for NHS treatment, “a rise of more than 50% since 2012.  Longer ques reduce the ongoing cost of ‘free healthcare’, and the NHS has been running short of cash for decades to which it always responds with more funding and reduced services.  And the Brits still claim to sport one of the best SP systems going.  So how come none of our leftwing readers know any of this?

President Trump is being pilloried for criticizing Schumer’s and TeddyK’s former policy on vetting people coming to the US, since the NYC Islamist killer got his green card under that policy.  Trump is accused of being inconsistent and “politicizing” yesterday’s latest ISIS inspired massacre.  Why?  After a previous terror attack he was asked within hours about what new policies are needed to prevent such attacks.  He correctly responded that it was then too early to start making new policies on the fly.  Today’s journalist mini-minds cannot parse the difference between making new policy and a timely attribution of plausible cause from then existing policies – those kinds of nuances are continually missed and passed on by the agenda-driven or light-thinking pretty boys of our news media.  And politicization of the massacre is their most ludicrous charge – they maintain that should be a no-no.  The massacre itself was a political act, inspired by a political organization that can only be countered by America’s political will to do so.   In such acts, politics is simply the sum and substance of that which leads to ongoing attacks on our culture and way of life.  Again, for our journalists it is a topic intellectually too hard to reach.

Consider today's congressional grilling of the legal mouthpieces for Google, Facebook, and Twitter about complicity in making their social media available for Russia’s (and others’) manufacture of fake news for American consumption - example: Russia started a riot in front of a Texas mosque with cleverly timed 'news' pieces calling out opposing factions.  Their testimony made one thing perfectly clear – immediately stop getting your news from social media, especially FB.  And that goes double for those who can’t find Iran on the map, or still believe that Islam is merely a religion of peace.

[3nov17 update]  Today a federal agency releases its latest climate change propaganda blast, the government’s Climate Science Special Report.  Theoretical physicist Dr Steven Koonin (here and here, also a former member of Obama’s administration) calls it ‘A Deceptive New Report On Climate’.  The report misrepresents historical data and is “misleading in more than a few important places.”  The Left, of course, is hailing it as the final definitive confirmation of preventable man-made global warming.  The beat for complete command and control goes on.

Adios California!  This sad report on California halfway in a flushing toilet adds to the stack that most Californians who speak English are familiar with.  H/T to a reader.  The leftwing responses to such fact-filled accounts are always entertaining in the schadenfreude sense. 

Former DNC head Donna Brazile’s expose of the corruption in the Democratic Party, led by none other than longtime head corruptress Hillary Clinton, documents more than just the crap that has been going down in that organization along with their uncritical and unread voters.  For the umpteenth time it confirms that our lamestream media outlets are firmly in the ideological bag for America’s socialists.  It is hard to conceive that as of today the NYT, ABC, NBC, CBS, not one of them, have made a peep about the scandal.  As documented here for years, these guys are today nothing more than the resurrected clones of USSR’s Pravda.

[4nov17 update]  Ramirez's succinct commentary on our immigration policy viz this week's terrorist attack in NYC.

 

Comments

[Walt]

Thanks George for the health care update. Paul may REALLY want to read that twice.(Yes Paul,, DEATH panels) Your at the DNR stage of the health care game. No, you won't get a say in the matter. Keep the measurements for your pine box in your pocket.
Your a BIG supporter of that "single payer". Well,, that's what you have to look forward too. Getting put down like Ol' Yeller. (and you didn't even have Hydrophoby.)

[Les Ismore]

Just like cars whose owners who don't do maintenance and beat their vehicles to death until they need to be crushed: smokers, drinkers, druggies and gorgers should just accept they are not covered by infinite health care. They could spend big buck of their own money and restore their "vehicle" on their own dime, but why should society throw good money after bad? Why waste a good lung on a raggedy ass smoker, or a liver, or kidney on a binge drinker or eater?

[George Rebane]

LesI 313pm - Good points. But who should be making those decisions for those patients? Some of our leftwing readers here liken private sector healthcare to a system that lets people die unattended under bridges. How do you see the NHS and other countries' death panels banning patients from surgery "indefinitely" being different?

[Account Deleted]

re LI at 3:13 - I agree to a point. Let us remember that car owners pay for their own cars including maintenance and insurance. And it's totally voluntary. Since the fattys and smokers HAVE to pay into a socialized or nationalised healthcare system, by what logic can you demand their money but deny them coverage?
The fact that their life style and habits make them more expensive to provide coverage to?
I get the basic idea, but once you go down that hole you are going to have an administrative nightmare of Biblical proportions. Remember that smokers are taxed heavily already. Seems like the govt just wants people to fall into bad habits, tax the bejeebers out of them and then deny them health care. The sooner they die, the better the bottom line for the govt.
Follow the money - why is it in the govts interest to keep anyone alive on the govt dime if that person isn't paying taxes?
" Why waste a good lung on a raggedy ass smoker, or a liver, or kidney on a binge drinker or eater?"
Or any public money on a person that refuses to produce something of value for society?
We can play this game all day long.

[Account Deleted]

One final thought - were the good folk in Great Britain told back in the 40s when they started their vaunted free health care system that later on some of them would be denied life saving procedures? Of course not. You pay into the govt system all your working life and then they pull the rug out from under you.
And the left complains about 'heartless' private health care insurance companies.
Hell - the govt is just running a flat out con game. And in GB the govt has all the guns. Isn't that convenient?

[Paul Emery]

So /walt how do you explain why Great Britain has a longer average life span than the United States? How do you explain why US is an astounding 43rd in average lifespans well behing such National Healthcare stalwarts as Japan Iceland Switzerland and Australia all of which have national socialistic health care systems. We are, I repeat, 43rd!!!

[Paul Emery]

Meant for Scott-6:22

[fish]

You’re right Punch! You should emigrate!

[Paul Emery]

Where's the beef Scott? Looks like people live longer under National Health Care Systems. Any idea why?

[Walt]

If their care is more to your liking Paul, MOVE.
You seem to like the idea of being controlled. If you prefer to give most of what you make to the gov. just to get "free stuff" that's your problem.
The people of this nation like it the way it was before people like you, and Progressives got their dirty paws on it.(hint.. that's why Trump got elected)
We kinda like making decisions for ourselves, and not Big Brother.

[Todd Juvinall]

The English live longer because they have no teeth. Ever seen their mouths? They gum their food. We have to chew. Makes it tougher. And we have more fun. Ever seen a Brit belly laugh? Never happens. I would rather be here in comedy central USA than that sober, sappy England.

[Walt]

Yup, we kicked out the Brits for a reason.

[Paul Emery]

George what is your speculation as to why people from countries that have national health care systems live longer than us ?

[Account Deleted]

from Paul - "Any idea why?"
Yes Paul, I do. It involves a whole list of variables that go far beyond the simple cherry picked bumper sticker factoid you keep harping at.
It involves demographics, influxes of people with poor health, life style choices and general attitudes of the citizenry.
Also a longer life doesn't always mean better:
http://www.bmj.com/content/329/7460/250.2.full
Wasn't able to get the full text, but other articles can support this idea.
Simply warehousing old folks and keeping them alive a few months longer doesn't always equate to a better health system. You might want to look up the stats on waiting times for needed tests and procedures in GB vs USA. Or Canada vs the USA.
Also - the govt health care system in GB is going broke.
Now maybe Paul can be kind enough to answer my question.

[George Rebane]

PaulE 1042pm - Paul, we've circled this barn many times over the years. Nothing much has changed in the reasoning. Adding on to ScottO's 741am I offer this as something more to consider when discussing the pro/cons of single payer (socialized) healthcare -
https://www.nationalcenter.org/NPA547ComparativeHealth.html

[Les Ismore]

Not sure where this nugget belongs, but the litter is flying over at the sandbox;

The proposed tax plan unveiled today sounds like a step in the right direction.

[Todd Juvinall]

Scott Pruitt may be doing something to keep the new report accurate. We will see.

[Paul Emery]

George

You argue that any form of universal health care will cause bankruptcy for it's sponsor yet not once has it happened so that takes the steam out of your argument. You also never provide any details as to what your health care remedy will be. Can you touch on that a little so we can continue the conversation based on your ideas ?

[Walt]

Your NOT getting Socialist health care Paul. Deal with it.

[Account Deleted]

Govts don't go 'bankrupt' Paul - they just plow deeper into debt. Socialized govts 'project' what the health care system will cost and it always costs way more. That's what happened to Medicare here in the states.
"The cost of Medicare is a good place to begin. At its start, in 1966, Medicare cost $3 billion. The House Ways and Means Committee estimated that Medicare would cost only about $12 billion by 1990 (a figure that included an allowance for inflation). This was a supposedly "conservative" estimate. But in 1990 Medicare actually cost $107 billion.
http://reason.com/archives/1993/01/01/the-medicare-monster
You might have noticed that Calif backed away from free health care because even the Dems knew there was no way to pay for it. Vermont tried single payer and bailed because of cost.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2015/01/25/costs-derail-vermont-single-payer-health-plan/VTAEZFGpWvTen0QFahW0pO/story.html
But those are just facts and mean nothing to you green libertarians.
We have provided all sorts of details of what we conservatives would recommend.

[George Rebane]

PaulE 1156am - I have never argued 'bankruptcy', but only that such systems are not sustainable because they survive only by reducing services and costing more to the extent that they devour a greater fraction of the GDP a nation is able to generate. And my remedies have populated these pages for years, and are a matter of record. They all revolve around allowing the minimally regulated markets provide services that people want, can afford, and are freely willing to provide to others. More detailed and diverse of such remedies are provided by the publications of Cato, Heritage, and other conservetarian institutions.

What your side has never shown is how such socialized healthcare approaches can survive without self-destructing. Citing the fallacy that in certain countries it has yet to happen is a specious argument akin to one who jumps off a tall building and extolls the pleasures of weightlessness and a refreshing breeze on the way down. Give us an example of a sustainable nationalized healthcare system, and point out the evidence of its sustainability.

[Walt]

One more thing to piss off the "green" brigade.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/03/bureaucrats-annoyed-us-emissions-levels-are-plummeting-despite-leaving-paris-deal/
"“It’s a bit of a paradox, here,” Angel Gurria, secretary-general of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD), told reporters Wednesday. The U.S. is pummeling Canada on the issue, he added, even though the latter has made ratcheting down fuel emissions a top priority."

[BunBun]

Po' ol' Trumpski,,,he tried to deny human causes for climate change,,,wanted to whitewash the EPA site,,,but his whitewashed whitehouse signed off on the report!!! Now we know why he had to get out of the country,,,to hide!!!

[Walt]

A little early to be smoking dope Doug.

[Paul Emery]

Boring Walt Try again

[Paul Emery]

George, socialized healthcare has survived for 60 years in most of Western Europe and has consumes much less of the GDP than our "system"' Currently we are the highest GDP healthcare numbers of ANY country in the world

[George Rebane]

PaulE 312pm - You sidestepped my 1255pm, and I presume have thus terminated the conversation.

[Walt]

You speaking for Bun,, Paul?

[Paul Emery]

link

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.XPD.TOTL.ZS

[Paul Emery]

George
I have clearly shown that "socialized healthcare approaches" can survive without self-destructing. You have shown me nothing otherwise. Please correct me if you can. Your opinion is mostly a gut feeling and is not sustained by ant facts or data. So we have the US with the highest GDP for healthcare, we're 47th in the world in life expectancy and millions soon to have no insurance at all if Trump and the Repubs get their way. Tell me whats good about that? Actually the % of GDP has been pretty much the same since Obamacare was inflicted on us.

[Don Bessee]

The people who the po' ol' fakenewsman bemoans will not have insurance is because they DO NOT WANT 0 care forced on them! How many people are now paying the fine instead of signing up for 0 care? ;-)

[Paul Emery]

I do not believe in Obamacare Don. Poor excuse for universal healthcare,

[George Rebane]

PaulE 337pm - You have not shown one single socialized healthcare system that is NOT self-destructing. They are all being kept alive with heroic additional fundings that come from diminishing other national services including defense spending. To socialists (you?) that is normalcy, 'business as usual'. To the rest of us it's a train wreck in process, terminally denied by the leftwing. And it is an additional train wreck that America does not need given all the ones we are currently funding to buy votes.

And I have provided RR readers with countless references to back up these assertions. Your response over the years has always been a period of silence, and then you start the same lap around the barn again. For example, on comparative longevity, check my 821am above.

[Account Deleted]

"I have clearly shown that "socialized healthcare approaches" can survive without self-destructing."
In this country?
Paul - Vermont tried and failed.
California Dems gave up because of cost.
Sabe?
What part of reality are you having a problem with?
If Americans had to start Euro free health care tomorrow there would be riots.
No semi private - you get put in a ward. No suing for millions if they cut the wrong part off. You have splitting headaches and need an MRI? Maybe a month, maybe 2.
Too old to be useful to society? No life-saving procedure for you. Please go and die.
That's reality, Paul.
And taxes will go through the roof.

[Don Bessee]

That's not the point @408. You throw around 'millions wont have ins.' but fail to acknowledge that people don't want it. You are happy to play the good party parrot and state that the President is throwing them off insurance when that is a lie. Even the scurrilous OMB admits that most all of the 'uninsured' don't want what is being forced on them or the skyrocketing costs that present no insurance benefit when deductibles are factored in.

So is someone really insured when they are being robbed of premiums that give them no usable benefits? All of that is so we can pay for illegal aliens benefits and sex changes for felons in prison. ;-)

[Paul Emery]

So who pays the bills for the "uninsured" if they get sick or injured Don or do we let them die in the streets?

[Todd Juvinall]

Do what I did for many years. I paid for my own with that thing called MONEY!

[Account Deleted]

"So who pays the bills for the "uninsured" if they get sick or injured Don or do we let them die in the streets? "
First of all - obviously not you. But keep up that virtue signalling. It heals no one but makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside. And that's the most important thing, right?
No one is dying in the streets, Paul. Stop it.

[Don Bessee]

Always a slave to the po' ol' party parrot line @ 610. ;-)

[Todd Juvinall]

I like that scene in DOC Hollywood where Michael J. Fox, the doc, gets paid for his services with a sow. SO Paul Emery, start raising pigs.

[Walt]

Love it. Paul states he has "proven" this or that.. "gave proof of",, and the truth is,,, NO,, NO you HAVEN'T!! Just plenty of crickets when asked to produce what you claim.

Give Venezuela a try Paul,, It's a fine Socialist nation.
With all that oil money they take in, healthcare should be better than ours. Check on that will you?

[Paul Emery]

So Todd healthcare is just for people that have money. Is that what you are contending?

[Paul Emery]

George

Why is it that before Obamacare ,our pathetic attempt at national healthcare healthcare was still 17% of the GDP ?

[Account Deleted]

"So Todd healthcare is just for people that have money. Is that what you are contending?"
Paul - are you contending that health care workers should be forced by the govt to work for free? Otherwise, how are they reimbursed? Are you gong to pay them?
You are soooo virtuous with other folks money.
Why don't all the left wing phonies like Paul Emery shut their pie holes and fund free health care for everyone?
Answer - because they're phonies. Why isn't food free, Paul? Don't we need food to survive?
Why isn't everything free?
Why doesn't Paul Emery work for free?

[news o' the day]

http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/02/growing-evidence-that-russia-using-the-resistance-to-stoke-division/

[Todd Juvinall]

Paul Emery, who pays for your healthcare? And if it is not you do you send them a ThankYou card? What a friggin mooch.

[Bill Tozer]

Re: Donna
Looks like they are beginning to distance themselves from My Gal Hill.....and Donna is trying to redeem whatever integrity she lost when CNN fired her for passing debate questions to “I’m with Me” Madame Secretary Clinton, a former Presidential candidate. That is a good sign for Donna.
Ms. Brazille ain’t going to fall on the sword for Hillary. Donna B. has character, albeit anyone who gets close to My Gal has their reputation tarnished for many moons.

Americans are a forgiving people when the transgressors show a degree of candor, honesty, contriteness, and remorse. Glad she did not use that line again “I am a Christian woman who knows what it is like to be prescetued and I am being persecuted!”, like she did when she got caught with her hand in the cookie jar after Wikileaks busted her for helping My Gal over Bernie . I do wish to say I like Donna B as a person and I most sincerely regret in advance her untimely suicide. My Gal is really really pissed off.

The Dems will sort it out one way or another. A time for cleansing and focusing on the most important election of the year next week.
Ah, forget about what Donna just revealed. She is just trying to shamefully peddle her book. It’s a nothingburger. Dare not look that way, must not look that way. Hey everybody, Robby Mook says to look over there, not over here. Got it, Mookie.

“On Friday, Robby Mook, Clinton’s campaign director, tried to take temperature down a bit. “Eye on the ball, Democrats!” he tweeted, saying the focus should be on the upcoming Virginia gubernatorial election. Others joined in.
“There is a race, a very important one, for governor in Virginia that if we are not careful could slip through our fingers,” said Clinton’s former spokesman, Brian Fallon, in an interview. “If [Ed] Gillespie were to pull of an upset there, it would basically ensure that Republicans would spend the next year running Trump-style campaigns that give in to race baiting because they will be convinced it is a successful strategy in the Trump era.”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/democrats-determined-to-wage-civil-war-forever

Hmm. The Republicans would give into race baiting? You mean like that ad the Dems just ran against Ed Gillespie (and had to pull because it was so vile and beyond over the top in it’s race baiting)?????
It’s true, it’s true. The Dems accuse the Republicans of everything they are doing themselves. Straight out of The Honored Sacred Cow Alinsky’s playbook. Or is that straight out of George Orwell? No matter. Their is no known cure for that kind of Broken Thinker Syndrome. Dare not look into the mirror, must not look in the mirror!

[Bill Tozer]

I just can’t get enough of that sweet stuff........

Re: More Donna....and who Donna splashed when she jumped in the mud puddle........like Hillary, Democrat leaders, the Democrat Party, Debbie, Mueller, and the Russian-Trump collusion narrative.

Donna, Donna, Donna. Its ok to jump in the mud puddle, but you are not allowed to splash those around you. But nooo. Donna got uppity and done walked off the reservation. Bad, girl, bad. Now get back to where you belong and follow the script.

“First, the corruption waters surrounding Hillary are getting too hot for comfort. We learned last week that the Clinton campaign paid for the infamous dossier that started the whole Russia collusion narrative. And it was revealed just yesterday that Team Hillary paid $168,000 to produce it. Like we have been saying for months, the Mueller investigation may turn against Democrats. And if they don’t have “Trump colluded with Russia” to assuage their Trump Derangement Syndrome, they’ve got nothing.

Second, after 18 months of trashing Trump, the Democrat Party’s approval rating is no better than his, which doesn’t bode well for its mid-term election hopes. Democrats are seen by an increasing number of Americans as a party of the extreme Left and not the mainstream.

So, it appears that since Clinton not only lost the election but blew up the narrative of how she was cheated out of it, Democrats are no longer willing to put up with her lying and corruption.

On an interesting and yet not surprising side note, the big three major news networks didn’t even bother to cover Brazile’s accusation in their newscasts last night. Heads in the sand?”

https://patriotpost.us/articles/52230

Dr. Rebane was correct as usual. Not a peep from the Big 3 networks. Hey, doesn’t Ben Rhodes brother run one of those networks?
“The Clintons are political syphilis, and they infected the DNC.” —Ben Shapiro

[news o' the day]

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/TODAY/z_Creative/DNCMemo%20(002).pdf

[Walt]

Just where will Progressives running for office get their hand ou..... uh, funding come next election? The DNC is broke, and big donors have more important things to spend their money on.. Like lawyers, and paying people to stay quiet.

[Mary Wanna]

President Chump is on his way to China after tearing up the TPP which represented 40% of world GDP and would have given him some influence during negotiations. Instead Chump will show up in China as some know-nothing, deeply in debt to China and try to throw his substantial weight around.
We have seen how well the world's greatest businessman Chump has done staffing government positions, enhancing border security, and fixing health the care system. Or, maybe he will just work on a hotel deal for himself.

[news o' the day]

http://rebaneruminations.typepad.com/.a/6a00e54f86f2ad8833017d3c2bdce4970c-pi

[fish]

Posted by: Mary Wanna | 04 November 2017 at 09:21 AM

Oh Mary.....you seem tense.....

BLAZE ON!

[Walt]

Keep singing the blues "marry". Reality shows you wrong.

[Paul Emery]

I'm on Medicare Todd. any problem with that? What health care do you have?

[Walt]

Take another hit "mary". A little "staffing" news you won't get from MSNBC.
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/04/senate-confirms-trumps-judicial-nominees-despite-democrats-opposition/

[Walt]

Good news (I guess) Paul lives to see another sunrise.
You already have OPM paying your Doc. , yet still yap about OPM healthcare. Be happy your not on the VA plan. I'm still fighting to get a simple CT scan. Yet my VA Doc. wrote the order back in July.

[Walt]

On the subject of today's update to this thread,, Another rental truck was used to kill. ( Yet NY wants more gun control because of the incident.)
There really needs to be a waiting period on rental trucks, and a real INVASIVE rectal exam for would-be truck renters.

[Russ Steele]

U.S. Report Says Humans Cause Climate Change, Contradicting Top Trump Officials,” crows the headline in The New York Times.

“Directly contradicting much of the Trump administration’s position on climate change, 13 federal agencies unveiled an exhaustive scientific report on Friday that says humans are the dominant cause of the global temperature rise that has created the warmest period in the history of civilization. (italics added)

“Over the past 115 years global average temperatures have increased 1.8 degrees Fahrenheit, leading to record-breaking weather events and temperature extremes, the report says.”

It is clear these government toads did not check climate history before writing this report.

https://www.iceagenow.info/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Holocene_Temperature_Variations-w-Cooling-Arrow.jpg

[Walt]

OK people, just why in hell is this not getting the press is needs?
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/875433/Black-Death-plague-2017-madagascar-outbreak-africa-world-health-organisation-virus-uganda

The "experts" kept the last big outbreak of Ebola under wraps too.
That played out well, until it almost went global.

[George Rebane]

RussS 1015am - More on the report. You may have missed my 3nov17 update.

[Todd Juvinall]

672 pages of computer models. Wow! and 1.8 degrees higher? WOW! I think all these grant whores and Obama bureaucrats that make their living off the hoax need to be weeded out and booted. My goodness, no facts but a lot of words.

[Mary Wanna]

Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 04 November 2017 at 10:57 AM

Sorry Todd, you cannot have it both ways. Obama inherited the Great Recession of 2008 and the economy was back on track by the time Trump was elected. But your ilk gives Trump credit for fixing everything by his mere presence. Using your logic the Climate Report was delivered during the Trump administration so your ilk gets to own it. Ouch!

[Gregory]

Skimming the guvmint climate report (you know, the one the White House was said to keep from being released... despite it being available for download for the better part of a year), and I was shocked that there was absolutely no mention of the galactic cosmic ray links to albedo, or the weak solar cycle 24 (and the forecast weak 25, 26, 27...). It was more of the same Mann, Schmidt, Alley. Same old same old.

Yes, Steven Koonin has a devastating oped in the WSJ, as good as his 2014 piece in the WSJ that summarized his investigation into climate science that the American Physical Society asked him to do for their review of the APS climate statement, but then ignored because he came to a different conclusion than the APS big Kahunas wanted. Koonin in an earlier life was the fellow who gave the coup de grace to Cold Fusion, back when he was the Provost of CalTech.

[fish]

Posted by: Mary Wanna | 04 November 2017 at 11:25 AM

Obama inherited the Great Recession of 2008 and the economy was back on track by the time Trump was elected.

O'Dummy and the Fed papered over the crisis with 8 Trillion dollar dollars stolen from the future!

Is every proggie idiot that posts here completely clueless as to what the F happened from 2007- 2010?

[George Rebane]

re MaryW 1125am - Here's another example of progressive blindness. Under Obama the economy was stifled for 8 years under the most horrendous strictures in American economic history since FDR's malfeasance during the Great Depression. We have never had such a slow recovery as ALL the available data shows, and for which the causes were very obvious to all but the country's socialists. Now that the hobbles are coming off, we can again see what America's industries, manufactories, and entrepreneurs can do. Obama's "back on track" was Hayek's classic 'Road to Serfdom'.

[Mary Wanna]

Posted by: fish | 04 November 2017 at 11:39 AM

Fish, you poor troll. Here are some graphs for you to look at

http://www.crfb.org/blogs/has-president-obama-doubled-national-debt

More here about Chumps trumped up claims,

http://www.crfb.org/blogs/has-debt-gone-down-12-billion-trump-took-office

[fish]

Posted by: Mary Wanna | 04 November 2017 at 11:46 AM

Barack Obama - The national debt grew the most dollar-wise during President Obama's two terms. He added $7.917 trillion, a 68 percent increase, in seven years. This was the fifth-largest increase percentage-wise. Obama's budgets included the economic stimulus package. It added $787 billion by cutting taxes, extending unemployment benefits, and funding public works projects. The Obama tax cuts added $858 billion to the debt in two years.

You enjoy your propaganda, I'll enjoy mine!

https://www.thebalance.com/us-debt-by-president-by-dollar-and-percent-3306296

[Walt]

I will put it into words "mary" can comprehend. When "O" was calling the shots, all you got to smoke was cheap leaf shake. With Trump. Fine, solid bud for all.

The last year of "O", Businesses were headed out of the country in droves. That all changed when Trump won the nomination.

"O" made sure the least amount of terrorists were killed in the war.
Today, our artillery is wearing out due to the heavy shelling of terrorists day in and day out.

Regulations have been repealed like never before.
Employment better than even before "O" showed up.
Over 1 million OFF the dole!
And Trump hasn't even been in office a YEAR.

Keep dreaming LIBS, It's going to be a cold day in hell before the nation votes the Progressives back into power.

Now Proggys,,, just why would "we" want a return of doom and gloom that Leftys like?

[Todd Juvinall]

Sorry mary wanna but Trump does deserve the credit and Obama the derision. You lib trolls are all the same. Trump's words alone have stifled cross-border illegals down 76% in one six month term. Yet You say Obama inherited a bad economy of which he was a voting part of. Trump never did any political voting prior to becoming President. So you are simply full of sh** as are all you nameless trolls of the left.

[Walt]

OH.. Yes! I have a question for you Proggys. How does it feel to now know your vote is meaningless? (at least in the primaries.)
The "ruling class" of your (ha)party says who you vote for.
The Clintons really had you by the short hairs. Clinton WAS the DNC.
Yet still failed to rig the game good enough.
And here they thought Russia was helping Hillary. (then any Russian involvement was just fine.)

It's going to be a long 8 years. Pace yourselves. (and try to come up with a real argument.)

[Paul Emery]

Todd

Since you're going back in time to the Bush years do you agree with Trump that Bush should have been impeached for lying to the American public about the War in Iraq?

[Mary Wanna]

Posted by: George Rebane | 04 November 2017 at 11:42 AM " Now that the hobbles are coming off"

Please list the hobbles that have come off since the new administration took over.

So happy that you believe you are gifted with divine omniscience.

All you are really doing is bitching about the past using your vast powers of 20/20 hindsight.

[Walt]

BDS ALERT!!! BDS ALERT!!! Sorry Paul,, that's not covered under your health care plan.

[Todd Juvinall]

Pail Emery as George says, you are circling the barn again.

[Paul Emery]

Todd

You are a Trump fan and supporter so I assume you agree with him that Bush should have been impeached. Unless you respond I'll add that to you're resume from now on.

[Todd Juvinall]

Paul Since you are a Johnson supporter and he has now admitted indiscretions with women, I will add you to those that endorse his behavior.

[Walt]

But Paul.. You didn't vote for Bush. So now you have no gripe.
(Just like when "O" comes up and you use the same disclaimer)
And like before, Yes,, WMDs WERE located. It wasn't politically expedient to advertise that. (not that you really give a shit. The fact of that doesn't play into your narrative.)

[George Rebane]

MaryW 132pm - You are again mistaken; no "divine omniscience" is claimed or needed to look at the historical record. Obama's malfeasance in 'guiding' the country's economy is well recorded by every outlet not promoting the socialist agenda. As witnessed by the limited reporting of non-agenda items by the lamestream (e.g. most recently Brazile's revelations), you all on the Left should try broadening your horizons. You'll note over the years that we on the Right constantly read what your guys are putting out and reporting on it along with referenced/cited criticisms. You should try the obverse.

[Mary Wanna]

Posted by: fish | 04 November 2017 at 11:53 AM

I enjoyed viewing your link. It shows me how selective you are in what you want to read. Lots of interesting factoids there.

"Barack Obama - The national debt grew the most dollar-wise during President Obama's two terms. He added $7.917 trillion, a 68 percent increase, in seven years. This was the fifth-largest increase percentage-wise."

Fifth-largest increase, Fish.
Bush has him beat though at the fourth-largest increase.

President Bush also responded to the 2001 recession by passing EGTRRA and JGTRRA. The Bush tax cuts further reduced revenue. He approved a $700 billion bailout package for banks to combat the 2008 global financial crisis. Both Presidents Bush and Obama had to contend with higher mandatory spending for Social Security and Medicare.

George R might find this one interesting since he is bitching about FDR and his recession,

"The New Deal cost billions. But FDR's major contribution to the debt was World War II spending. He added $209 billion to the debt between 1942 and 1945."

And another big hit to the debt was Wilson's, having to pay for WW1.

Another interesting thing I noticed is this, "The Obama tax cuts added $858 billion to the debt in two years."

What, did Obama cut taxes?

So, Fish, the question of the day: what do you think Trump's tax overhaul is going to do to the debt?

[Paul Emery]

Gary Johnson admitted indiscretions with women ? That's a new one for me Can you educate me as to who, when, where?

[Mary Wanna]

Posted by: George Rebane | 04 November 2017 at 01:55 PM

As Fish likes to say, "You enjoy your propaganda, I'll enjoy mine!"

http://prospect.org/article/scandalous-lack-obama-administration-scandals

[Mary Wanna]

Oh, and Walt, you are rambling on and on but never offer any verifiable factoids.

[Todd Juvinall]

Oh Paul Emery answer the question.

Mary Wanna, at least we know who Walt is. You are just a green potted plant full of hallucinogenic drugs

[Mary Wanna]

George R,

"[Nov. 3 update] Former DNC head Donna Brazile’s expose of the corruption in the Democratic Party, led by none other than longtime head corruptress Hillary Clinton, documents more than just the crap that has been going down in that organization along with their uncritical and unread voters. For the umpteenth time it confirms that our lamestream media outlets are firmly in the ideological bag for America’s socialists. It is hard to conceive that as of today the NYT, ABC, NBC, CBS, not one of them, have made a peep about the scandal. As documented here for years, these guys are today nothing more than the resurrected clones of USSR’s Pravda."

Now that is what I call a load of manure! Where is Fox News? Why didn’t they scoop all of the so-called lame stream? They could only bitch about NBC, CBS, ABC. And as usual they lied!

Nov. 2nd, https://www.cbsnews.com/news/donna-brazile-bashes-clinton-campaign-in-new-book/

Nov. 3rd, https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/trump-seizes-brazile-book-excerpt-revives-cries-rigged-dnc-primary-n817246

Nov. 4th, “Her book, “Hacks: The Inside Story of the Break-ins and Breakdowns That Put Donald Trump in the White House,” will be released on Tuesday. The Post said it had obtained an advance copy. The New York Times has not obtained a copy of the book.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/04/us/politics/donna-brazile-clinton-biden.html

Nov. 3rd, http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/sunday-week-dnc-chair-donna-brazile/story?id=50922422

Nov. 3rd, MSNBC Morning Joe airs at 3am pacific. You must have slept in.
http://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch/brazile-s-book-shocking-for-exposing-collusion-heilemann-1087770179834

[Walt]

Nice try "mary". I always put forth facts. If I found them so can you. (Paul never reads so why bother?)
Since your last post was a clear as mud, I will that it you mean the WMD statement. Yes, they were found. Some went to Syria.(and used not long ago. Forget?)
You go right ahead and believe what LIB news tells you. I will believe the word of those who were there. Go to ANY VA hospital or clinic and ask those waiting to see a Dr. (Not that you ever would).

You can bet your Liberal ass any facts are considered Secret.
You know, national security and all that fun stuff.
HELL!! The JFK files have yet to be fully released. And you think everything has been disclosed on the WMDs? Go smoke another dooby.

[Walt]

"mary"
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/11/04/dnc-gave-clinton-control-over-campaign-well-before-it-was-supposed-to-docs.html

[Mary Wanna]

"walt"

Fox Headline, "Big Three Networks skip Donna Brazile bombshell that DNC was rigged for Clinton".

Now we know where George R gets his news.

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/11/03/big-three-networks-skip-donna-brazile-bombshell-that-dnc-was-rigged-for-clinton.html

You enjoy your propaganda, I'll enjoy mine! "The Fish"

[Mary Wanna]

Posted by: Todd Juvinall | 04 November 2017 at 02:36 PM

Word is you are no better than that other blogger you complain about who moderates anyone whose opinion he does not share!

Your ilk are in good company,

https://cpj.org/reports/2006/05/10-most-censored-countries.php

[Walt]

And your gripe is???
http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2017/11/04/abc-cbs-nbc-fail-cover-braziles-claim-dnc-rigged-primary-clinton/
"Media Research Center Vice President Dan Gainor told Fox News:

The Donna Brazile story is astonishing. The media loves to tell stories of Republican discord. Here’s the woman who was the interim head of the DNC saying Bernie Sanders got screwed by the party and Team Clinton. No matter how much the media wants to hide that, it’s a huge issue and will impact future elections. "

[fish]

Posted by: Mary Wanna | 04 November 2017 at 01:56 PM

So, Fish, the question of the day: what do you think Trump's tax overhaul is going to do to the debt?

Make it worse.

"Barack Obama - The national debt grew the most dollar-wise during President Obama's two terms. He added $7.917 trillion, a 68 percent increase, in seven years. This was the fifth-largest increase percentage-wise."

Fifth-largest increase, Fish.
Bush has him beat though at the fourth-largest increase.

Congrats....you make a strong case for his being almost as bad as Bush the Lesser!

[fish]

Posted by: Mary Wanna | 04 November 2017 at 01:56 PM

I enjoyed viewing your link. It shows me how selective you are in what you want to read. Lots of interesting factoids there.

The repetitive nature off your word choice (factoid, factoid, factoid) makes me wonder if this isn't really a certain serial molester of all you can eat buffets sure that the internet is changing the way we communicate?

Posted by: Mary Wanna | 04 November 2017 at 02:07 PM

As Fish likes to say, "You enjoy your propaganda, I'll enjoy mine!"

You'd be scandal free too if you had a fellatially devoted press corp running interference for your admin!

http://prospect.org/article/scandalous-lack-obama-administration-scandals

[Bonnie McGuire]

This is wonderful! And it's honestly revealing. If you want to have discussions with all viewpoints ya have to come here. No one goes to the other blog where only those who agree with one another go. Boring.

[Russ]

World needs ‘brainwashing’ on climate change, Jerry Brown says at Vatican

He is looking for a religious transformation, ignoring science and adopting the anthropogenic climate change chant for the brainwashing.

Brown acknowledged that achieving transformation will not be easy, citing his recent visit to the Eastern Economic Forum in Russia, where world leaders gathered for discussions about trade with scant mention of climate effects.

“At the highest circles, people still don’t get it,” he said. “It’s not just a light rinse” that’s required. “We need a total, I might say ‘brainwashing.’

“We need to wash our brains out and see a very different kind of world.”

Well, they tried to reason, propaganda and fear and they did not work so now they are resorting to brainwashing. They better hurry the placet has been cooling for the last 8,000 years, and we are about to have another little ice age. A little-accelerated cooling.

[George Rebane]

MaryW 242pm - my report had a time stamp on it. After the silence and nationwide opprobrium directed at them, they started reporting it.

[Paul Emery]

Todd

No luck finding anything about Gary Johnson as you claimed. You have a tenancy to be a liar and make things up so I assume that's the case.

[Todd Juvinall]

Paul Emery, You really are dense.

[Walt]

Fish. Libs are so embarrassed they have to post "in drag".
Ol' Bunbun sure comes off as a masculine name,,, right?
And if your correct about "mary",, well,,, nuff said.